Old Wiring & Dimmer Switches

[sossage]

Hi,

Currently got a single ceiling light with one on/off switch in a room.

I want to replace with 5 x Low Voltage downlights and 3 x Dimmer Switches (1 by door, 1 x either side of bed).

I've had a look at the existing on/off switch to replace with a dimmer and there is just 2 wires (red & black) and No Earth at all.

Q1: I would imagine that i would connect the Red to the Common & the Black to the L1 on the new dimmer by door ?

Q2: No idea what i'd need to run to the 2 x bedside switches.

Q3: Bearing in mind that there is only a Red & Black and No Earth, would i be better re-running the wiring so that i get an Earth connection - if so, what should a connect the earth to ? i.e. clamp to cold water pipe etc ?

Please help !

Thanks in a advance.

 

[amtodd]

Recessed lights are hot things in enclosed areas and especially hazardous when surrounded by loft insulation. It is always a good idea to make sure your fittings are well ventilated and not touching any cables, pipes, timbers or insulation.

Q1. correct assumption, however a few LV lighting transformers cannot be dimmed - you may need to check this before you purchase.

Q2. Need more info. Why have three dimmers? how wide is your bed or is the other half too lazy to turn it off for you ? more seriously are all of the dimmers supposed to control all five lights as one set , or is there to be more than one circuit? where are the downlights going to be wall, pelmet, coving or ceiling? can you get above where ever you are going to put the lights? is the wall the extra switches are going into stud or will you have to chase it out? is the system loop in? - see the how to pages to find out details. We might then be able to assist you.

An fun alternative approach is at http://www.maplin.co.uk/images/catalog/pictures-all/LargeImages/ModuleImages/24907i0.jpg it is about £20. Reconnect the pendant set above the ceiling instead of through it, plug in the device and use a bayonet plug to feed your low level lights. This way you can spend longer looking for the remote control than you would have rewiring the whole house.


Q3. Chances are someone has cut the earth back so it is there somewhere just a bit short, but unless your light switch is metal fronted there will be nothing to earth to anyway. If you have metal fittings or switches, you will need to attach all of the earths through the system, or run an earth wire back to the consumer unit. Clamping to a pipe may work and it may not, but it definitely isn't regulations.

 

[sossage]

Thanks for the swift reply - and you have definately sussed out that i am: -

a) lazy
b) probably being too flash

basically i wanted that "hotel" luxury of controlling the lights from either side of the bed, but definately not an essential !

downlights will be in the ceiling (bungalow, so easy access from the loft) - i was going to wire the transformer in place of the existing ceiling rose and then run the lights from this.

Switches - there is one existing by the door, the others i will have to chase out (block wall construction) - not too much of a problem with this - will wire in loft and then run vertically down to one switch and horizontally to the other.

It seems the Earth is the biggest problem, i was thinking of just attaching a new two-core + earth cable to the old cable and pulling it back through, but if i can't find an earth then i guess that probably won't help much (although it would have to be done anyway i guess).

I think i'm ok with the wiring to the other switches (using 3-core + earth cable) - ?

so i guess my follow up questions (sorry another epic post) are: -

Q1: Am i ok using the existing ceiling rose connections to power the transformer ?

Q2: I'm using metal-fronted dimmers (typical) - so i definately need to sort out the earthing issues.

Cheers again,

 

[amtodd]

Boy can you type fast!
Lazy is no problem, if you're prepared to work at it!

As for three dimmers on one circuit - two is managable, however three would require a intermediate dimmer if such a thing exists. Breezer will know. I personally would use a basic intermediate switch at the door, and a dimmer either side of the bed. You still get the hotel style light switches both sides of the bed, and can turn on or off from the entrance to the room. I'm sure there's a HOW TO on intermediates, but if there isn't HamiltonAndy has answered treads on the subject, search the site by his handle. Of course in hotels lots of wiring and pipe work is behind false walls / panels etc making the job loads easier.

Q1. Yes. i'd reassemble the rose above the ceiling and run the transformer out like it were the pendant.

Q2. Hopefully there will be an earth in the rose so you only need to rewire the switch circuits. If the earths are just cut short, you may be able to extend them / pull slack out of cables so they reach, otherwise you will have to rewire the entire loop in circuit from the consumer unit.

Best of luck. Once you've finished you'll be glad of the lie-in afforded by your new bedside dimmers!

 

[sossage]

Cheers - much appreciated.

Hopefully there is an intact earth - so fingers crossed.

As for the multitude of dimmers, i may start off by using one by the door, and getting some bedside lamps until i'm more experienced at these things.

Once again, thanks for your help - will keep you posted.

Cheers,

 

[breezer]

I could not find a "regular" intermeadiate dimmer but i did find

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Technical/DataSheets/Systems/TouchRemote.htm

it says you can have "multiple dimmers" may cost a bit though

 

[sossage]

Cheers Breezer - i'll check it out