One pipe system, industrial style pipes: boiler exploded...

[Agile]

You are missing the point again Tony and over complicating the issues.

What is underfloor heating other than a series of one pipe loops.

I never mentioned underfloor heating.

I said "heat emitters" meaning radiators or skirting heating. Not in this instance UFH as that is unlikely to be relevant unless they are digging up all their floors. many of the old London houses I see with one pipe systems have thick oak block floors as they were popular at that time.

The boiler return cannot be lower in themperature than the lowest return temperature.

Tony

 

[monkeybird]

ho hum...

All that time taking and posting photos and you guys just want to argue!

 

[doitall]

Don't worry about Tony and me we go back a long way monkeybird.

Can you send me a zoomed out pic of the boiler and cylinder.

 

[doitall]

You are missing the point again Tony and over complicating the issues.

What is underfloor heating other than a series of one pipe loops.

I never mentioned underfloor heating.

I said "heat emitters" meaning radiators or skirting heating. Not in this instance UFH as that is unlikely to be relevant unless they are digging up all their floors. many of the old London houses I see with one pipe systems have thick oak block floors as they were popular at that time.

The boiler return cannot be lower in temperature than the lowest return temperature.

Tony

No Tony I mentioned underfloor as an example of a one pipe loop.

An primary flow and return to the cylinder is only a one pipe loop.

On a temperature controlled circuit the boiler return can quite easily be lower than the circuit, because the pump circulates the water around the system, and the blender/compensator opens and closes to allow heated water into the circuit, with flow and return stats you can maintain a 20c differential across the boiler quite simply.

 

[monkeybird]

Here you go (posted on here for others who might be able to help to see also). Boiler is an Ideal Stelrad Mexico (a dead one). Cylinder seems very small for size of house. Hope you can see what you need here

View media item 3962 View media item 3961

 

[doitall]

The cylinder looks suspiciously like a Fortic Primatic, can you see any writing on the cylinder at the seam just below the domed part and above the two pipes in your pic

 

[spacethegas]

whats wrong with the boiler ?

 

[monkeybird]

Doitall, there's a sticker where you mentioned: it says 'Baguley... Churchill Medium Duty Indirect'. Is this what you meant...?

The boiler has given up. We knew this when the carbon monoxide alarm went off and we had to vacate the house with the kids. There was a leak and water all over the utility floor, steam etc..

WE have had problems with CO spikes before and even if it is fixable, I am no longer prepared to take the risk. We had a CORGI guy in to 'service' it 6 months ago and he said it was fine. Either he was a fool who didn't know what he was doing (entirely possible) or it is just too old.

 

[monkeybird]

CO reading this time was 200ppm plus BTW.

 

[doitall]

Not quite but it will do you have two tanks in the roof a big en and a smaller en.

 

[monkeybird]

The other half confirms (I don't do lofts, what with those mahooooooooosive spiders... ) that there are indeed a big and a small tank in the loft.

 

[simond]

The problem with a one pipe system is the temperature gradient from the radiator nearest the heat source, to the one furthest away.

Also the warm up time from scratch is longer than with a fully pumped system.

Other than these minor things it will work similarly to a 2 pipe system. Personally I like the school rads and the Kidd is ideally suited to this type of legacy system because of it's old school construction.

Its interesting the term you use to describe Mr Kidd jnr because that's exactly what we call him in the office. Luckily he can't read this because he is not connected.

I keep trying to get him to get a web site (ours is the only one I think showing his products) and if you tell him how you found his boilers he may take note.

But then again, probably not.

 

[doitall]

The temperature gradient would depend on the size of the system.

The old school type rads, which I also like for what it's worth, are meant to have a longer heat cycle at a lower temperature, a simple controlled temperature circuit as per my pic is ideal. If you add a vertical low loss header, you can connect any boiler to it, although I would favor the Broag.

 

[spacethegas]

i would repair the boiler.
leaking heat exchanger i assume.

 

[monkeybird]

OK, see you all agree the radiators are nice...
But you still don't agree on the solution!

How's a poor rookie to know what to do ?

So could I ask some straightforward questions?

1. If we do replace the boiler, presumably the pipework between there and the cylinder will need replacing? Does this have to be anything special given the rest of the system?

2. Is it best to put in a new cylinder? If so what would you recommend?

3. Sounds like for our needs you're recommending a Kidd 2 (well that's what Mr Kidd suggested...) or something called a Broag? Are the other boilers you guys recommend (Vaillant? Worcester? etc) also worth considering? I'm asking because if I am going to find an engineer/installer to do it, I may have to go through the boiler manufacturer's recommendations.

4. Mr Kidd also suggested getting someone to 'take out a section of pipe' to check for sludge etc. He suggested flushing the system but I've heard different views about whether this would place too much stress on the joins etc? Would be grateful for a definitive view? On the previous message someone suggested something called a magnaclean or ventiflow or summat...

5. Are you able to recommend a ballpark figure for these bits of work because I have NO IDEA what is should cost and need to know what will be reasonable from a quote...

Not much to ask then!

Thanks by the way: I really appreciate some expert and neutral help with this...