Opening up blocked cellar...

[StrictlySocial]

Hi,

I've recently bought an old pub (c1750) that was converted to a house in the 70s. I've got hold of some plans for the house which show the (rough) position of the internal cellar entrance when it was still a pub, and I was verbally told by the previous owners where the think the external entrance was (there is nothing on the plans other than saying there is an external entrance).

Based on that info I've been drilling some exploratory holes to see what I could find. Externally I drilled through 30cm of cement before reaching what appears to be clay. Internally I drilled a number of holes near the documented entrance and managed to at least smell and feel the air from the cellar even if I see it. I've also put a boroscope down the internal hole but unfortunately it was blocked by a mix of stones and brick.

Has anybody on here got any experience of opening up a cellar? There seems to be a real lack of info on the web about doing this. I was hoping to drill a bit and then uncover an obvious entrance but that hasn't been the case so far. I could continue drilling deeper internally (and making the hole wider), however I'm not sure whether have found the original entrance of whether I am just drilling through the cellar ceiling...

Any advice would be appreciated as the builders I have spoke to don't seem to want to know until I find the entrance...

I don't believe the cellar was blocked for structural reasons. The plans I have suggest it was done based on the layout of the house.

 

[JohnD]

have you lifted some floorboards yet?

 

[big-all]

have you lifted some floorboards yet?

yes my thoughts as well but may be filled with rubble and concreted over

 

[StrictlySocial]

Where I believe the external entrance was

 

[StrictlySocial]

Unfortunately everything is concrete. There are no floorboards.

 

[StrictlySocial]

This is the internal hole I created. It is solid for about 10cm then is void for another 5cm before hitting some more rock/brick.

 

[StrictlySocial]

have you lifted some floorboards yet?

yes my thoughts as well but may be filled with rubble and concreted over

This is what I believe they may have done which is why the entrance isn't obvious.

 

[JohnD]

Unfortunately everything is concrete. There are no floorboards.

In which case no doubt they cut out the old wooden floor, possibly letting it fall into the cellar, then filled it up with rubble, then concreted over the top. So you no longer have a cellar, you have a damp block of rubble and concrete that you can break up and dig out if you want to badly enough.

 

[bernardgreen]

Try and find old photos of the building. Many pubs had an entrance in the pavement in front of the building where the barrels were lowered into the cellar. While it is unlikely but not impossible to re-open that entrance it would confirm that there was a cellar or under ground passage at that point just inside the building. That would be a starting point to explore the extent ( if any ) of the cellar.

 

[StrictlySocial]

Thanks. I'm planning on trying to find some old photos anyway so hopefully that will help.

Based on the position of the air vents (which unfortunately I can't get the boroscope through) the cellar is going to be pretty big. I'd be surprised if they completely filled it as it would have been a big job to do - here's hoping they haven't.

 

[JohnD]

if you have a concrete floor, what do you suppose it is standing on?

 

[Belboz]

if you have a concrete floor, what do you suppose it is standing on?

Barrels (full of beer)

 

[endecotp]

Talk to the neighbours. See if the council have planning records for the change of use or building regs records for filling the cellar. Track down the retired former landlord!

 

[StrictlySocial]

if you have a concrete floor, what do you suppose it is standing on?

You do wonder. At the moment I'm just finding suspended concrete everywhere... You would hope something is holding it up

 

[StrictlySocial]

Talk to the neighbours. See if the council have planning records for the change of use or building regs records for filling the cellar. Track down the retired former landlord!

Next door is also a pub. I was planning on getting the landlord to see whether he knows anyone who is used to go/work there. There are lots of local life timers so I'm sure there is at least one.

I also called the brewery to see if they had any records but apparently they lost everything over 5 years old.

I've got some plans around the change of use, however nothing concerning the cellar as such other than the plans saying they are blocking it off and another saying they are just moving the internal entrance (which I assume never happened). The plans I have do show the original entrance position though (which is where I have been drilling).