Opening Up Two Rooms

[securespark]

Hello

I have two rooms that have both been extended out into the back garden. Where the original back wall of the house was, steels have been put in to support the brickwork above the opening.

These steels rest on brick at either end. Actually, these steels have been badly installed because the floor above has a gradient, but that is another issue.

The wall separating the original rooms is solid block & brick (house built c 1960), the wall separating the extended parts of the rooms is stud.

Here is a picture of the wall from under the floor above:


I guess this wall is not structural?

I understand it is connected to the brick supports currently holding up the two steels, but if these were replaced with one longer steel, then I guess that wall could come down?

I shall post a diagram as soon as I can.

 

[John D v2.0]

So one steel goes to each side of the house and the other ends of each is resting on a new pillar along the line of the old and new wall? And that's the one you want to remove completely, apart from the pillar?
If that, according to your photo it's not holding the joists up but it will be providing some stability to the pillar. The other ends of the steels may be providing lateral stability and the wall night be providing front to back stability.
How big is the pillar on the central wall? You would need an SE to calculate how much you need to leave behind, or what you can replace it with.
Hope this helps - Sorry if I've got the wrong end of the stick!

 

[securespark]

Thanks, John.

I am desperate to upload a diagram but I have a new scanner and am having trouble finding where it has stored the image.

 

[securespark]

Now Photobucket is phukced. I have had to photograph the diagram....

And now it works.....

And now it doesn't.....

 

[securespark]

The wall in the photo is the wall on the diagram against which is written "BRICK +BLOCK WALL"

 

[tony1851]

Is it that you want to go full width across the house with one new continuous beam (and scrapping the pier altogether) or do you just want to remove the brick dividing wall and keep the existing pier and beams?

 

[securespark]

Tony, thanks!

Yes, I want to replace the two with a longer (around 5m) beam.

I will have to keep the piers at either side but, yes, I want to scrap the one(s) in the middle, which are either side of the brick and block wall I would like to remove.

 

[securespark]

Strange. I don't see my two images on the website, but if I log in via the mobile app, they appear.
Does anyone else not see them?

 

[securespark]

Hi John

If the wall is providing front to back stability, then I may need a cross (+) made up of three beams. Is that what you're saying?

 

[tony1851]

Front-to-back stability won't be an issue. What might be an issue is side-to-side stability. Whether or not it is depends on several factors, including the
lengths of walls in the existing house and extension which run side-to-side at ground floor level. These provide lateral stability to the house.
if there are insufficient walls to provide stability, the bco can ask for a goal-post frame. This entails the new beam being supported off steel columns at each end
and the connections between beam and columns being made especially rigid. This frame then reinstates the rigidity lost by removing the existing central brick pier.

 

[John D v2.0]

Hi John

If the wall is providing front to back stability, then I may need a cross (+) made up of three beams. Is that what you're saying?

Hi secure spark, as Tony says that won't be an issue if you change to a single beam. As it has no where to fall to. The SE will calculate the beam to make sure it won't twist or anything, but it may have to be generally bigger so stick out more.

 

[securespark]

Thanks folks!

The original job was done in 1992 (before we moved in) but I know that BC got involved as I have spoken to them about the flat roof (other thread!) which they were not involved in.

Are you saying the brick piers (which I guess are remnants of the original rear wall of the house will not be sufficient to support the longer beam (minus the central piers), hence the goalpost?

 

[tony1851]

If the piers stick out from the walls around 9" or so, they should be able to take the vertical compressive load, subject to decent padstones, which the SE designs.

But this is only assuming you don't have to install a goal-post for lateral stability, in which case of course all the load goes down the steel columns and on to separate pad foundations. In this case, the piers are cut away complete and the steel columns butted tight up to the walls.

 

[John D v2.0]

Further to Tony, in our case we could have the brickwork sticking out at the sides to avoid chasing steel channels onto the walls, and a deeper beam on top. But the architect recommended his other suggested structure which was a pillar in the middle, because the pillar would split the span. I suppose some of the lateral stability comes from the column and some from next door, who still have that wall!
If you are happy to have a pillar to save on cost you can get a better design in other ways! We are working the pillar into the island.
Hopefully a good se can advise based on what s/he can see.

 

[securespark]

Thanks both guys!
Could do with your helpful advice on my roofing thread!

We have an architect we know coming over soon to have a look.