Part P and Scotland

[Richard1]

Can anyone briefly outline any differences to the requlations regarding part P between Scotland and England,
I understand they work under the warrant but is this still based on BS7671?
Thanks

 

[Taylortwocities]

If you go to the WIKI //www.diynot.com/wiki/electrics

there are two sections, one for Scotland (Building Warrants) and one for Part P.

Its all there!

 

[Richard1]

Thanks, I have already looked there, That document is dated 2003, and revised 2006, I did not know whether there had been any changes since then.

 

[skenk]

You need to ask or find out about the procedures from the local authority area in Scotland the work is being done, as they vary widely in their interpretation of the rules. Be prepared for the BC officer on the other end of the phone not having a clue what you're on about though.

 

[baldelectrician]

You need to ask or find out about the procedures from the local authority area in Scotland the work is being done, as they vary widely in their interpretation of the rules. Be prepared for the BC officer on the other end of the phone not having a clue what you're on about though.

Well said. I find some councils take the electrical certification very seriously (almost relogiously) and some couldn't care less

Where I am (Ayrshire) the 3 local councils take it quite seriously

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Is that seriously as in "scrupulously ensuring that they act within the law and don't try to impose restrictions and requirements which they are not entitled to", or seriously as in "we are going to do our best to ban DIY"?

 

[skenk]

Can anyone briefly outline any differences to the requlations regarding part P between Scotland and England,
I understand they work under the warrant but is this still based on BS7671?
Thanks

Is that seriously as in "scrupulously ensuring that they act within the law and don't try to impose restrictions and requirements which they are not entitled to", or seriously as in "we are going to do our best to ban DIY"?

Part P: England and Wales

Well documented but something like this:

You must either be a scheme member (ELECSA/NAPIT/NICEIC etc.) to certify certain works (special locations, kitchens . . . ) OR notify LABC & pay before work starts and they are responsible for inspection and testing and certification (although some may force you to get it tested yourself which could cause problems).

All Work whether notified or not and done by trade or diy should be carried out to (English) building regs.


Scotland - Building Warrant System:

Certain works whether done by trade or diy should have a building warrant ('LABC notification') The criteria for works which require a warrant are different to those that require notification in England. The details are at the end of the document linked to above but includes such idiosyncrasies* as- (in a flat or 3storey+): No warrant req'd for a new shower, boiler or fan anywhere but a new socket or light in any room should have one.

Application fee £100 for works costing up to £5000 (total cost of all work specified in the warrant, electrical and otherwise) the fee goes up based on the cost of the work. You also need to have drawn up 1:100 plans of the proposed and existing property showing changes and new electrical (and any other) work for the warrant application.

BC accept completion certificate to pass installation. It is up to them to verify the electrical installation and in practice SOME BC's^ will just accept a completed EIC (by whoever).

However SOME BC's^^ insist that the cert is submitted by a NICEIC/SELECT member (the only 2 schemes in Scotland with the usual high annual fees) . This policy appears to prohibit DIY for works where a building warrant is required although I do not know if some BC's may accept PIR done by someone else.

If a NICEIC/SELECT contractor is used then the warrant fee may be reduced by a small amount £10?) dependent on the policy of the indicidual BC. This is the only financial benefit to the customer of using a registered spark (as opposed to non-registered or diy) if the BC does not require one to complete cert.

Work NOT requiring a warrant (lots incl most in 2 storey buildings) does not need to be notified to BC and in practice a LOT of work is done without certificates being issued (and, I suspect, testing being done) - it is not required for BC compliance.

All work whether notified or not and done by trade or diy should be carried out to (Scottish) building regs.


Apart from the notification process there are slight differences in building regs for accessory locations in new-build and fire regulations between the Scottish and England/Wales systems. There may well be others.


*phew!
^Glasgow, Angus, ???
^^Edinburgh, 3x Ayr Councils, ???



Personally, I test and issue certificate for everything altered although I would not test eg a ring for L-N IR if only changing a socket or issue a certificate for eg a replacement heater unless the customer is willing to pay £10 extra for MWC (almost never). I see poor installations everywhere - seem to be following someone around who is putting in 6-way GET MCB boards with no bonding in nice victorian flats with the well-to-do owners non the wiser to their shoddy installation. (well only seen 2 of the GET's -both recent- but I can only think of a single installation that I have seen that would meet with the standards you'd expect of a new installation -before I got there!)

I am not yet a member of SELECT/NICEIC and the BC here seem failry lax as to giving a to55 about the electrical work done under their watch. If i'm made to join an expensive scheme in the future i'll see it as a Scottish 'Part P Tax' For the benefit of the safety of everyone I would like to see some kind of system where standards are met and i'm not being undercut by cowboys and their 6-way no rcd's or bonding crap, new lighting circuits with earths cut off throughout, showers and cookers all wrong etc etc. Good customers think you're trying to fleece them when you tell them you can't connect their new shower to their old fuseboard because prevous 'sparks' have just plonked in whatever.

Plenty of remedial work tho!

Also I completely disagree with the principle of banning DIY and the idea of these unelected trumpet-blowers (schemes) having power over things.



PS
Above info on warrant system is all "As Far as I Know (AFAIK)" if anyone can verify, correct or expand on it i'd be much obliged! (baldelectrician?) Does anyone else out there know the policy of their council in Scotland with regard as to who they accept installation certificates from?

bed

 

[baldelectrician]

My local council;

http://www.east-ayrshire.gov.uk/devser/documents/bscompcertnobwadvice.pdf

As I said earlier, things are tighter up here (sometimes)