Pointless points

[EFLImpudence]

I'm not interested in watching the football but while looking at the scores and tables wondered what is the point of the points given for a win or a draw?

Whatever values are given for a win or a draw, as long as it is obviously higher for a win, then the teams are in the same order as the win, draw and loss columns.
It could be a hundred and seven for a win and twenty three for a draw; it would still be the same order.

The only difference in the domestic leagues is that between a score draw and a no-score draw (although there haven't been any no-score draws yet) but even this would work out the same with a different column for each.

Why bother with the points?

 

[rsgaz]

It could be a hundred and seven for a win and twenty three for a draw; it would still be the same order.

Not always, 2009 Champions League, group H...

By your scoring system, Real would have topped the group, but they didn't. Juve topped it with less matches won.

Unless you are specifically talking about the World Cup, where, when you only play each team once, you can't have a group where one team has drawn all their games (i.e. has 3 points) and another team has only 3 points from a single win.

 

[Brigadier]

Why bother with the points?

I don't think FIFA are that bothered either, as long as "the right team" gets through each time.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Not always, 2009 Champions League, group H...

By your scoring system, Real would have topped the group, but they didn't. Juve topped it with less matches won.

I was talking about the World Cup but thought it would apply to all.

In your example, I would have thought that a team with four wins would top a team with three - especially as the points are equal.
If that's how they do it, I suppose that answers my question.

Unless you are specifically talking about the World Cup, where, when you only play each team once, you can't have a group where one team has drawn all their games (i.e. has 3 points) and another team has only 3 points from a single win.

Why not? Isn't one win better than three draws?

 

[EddieM]

I was talking about the World Cup but thought it would apply to all.

In your example, I would have thought that a team with four wins would top a team with three - especially as the points are equal.
If that's how they do it, I suppose that answers my question.


Why not? Isn't one win better than three draws?

Depends on GD.

 

[Ihavenojob]

I thought this was about the programme "pointless" but as it isn't , in the words of Peter Jones "I'm out" .

 

[rsgaz]

especially as the points are equal.

That particular example is a peculiar one. In English football, if points are level, it goes to goal difference next, and if they're also equal, then it goes by 'goals for'. The Champions league works a bit different, Juve topped the group by having scored better against Real over their two matches, I can't remember whether goal diff would have took precedence if it was different, they change the rules now and then (so no point me looking up the current Champions League rules).

Why not?

If there is a team whose stats are 3 draws, then the other 3 teams in their group will all have at least one 'D' in their 3 games, won't they? And can therefore not finish with a win and two losses.

What I was getting at was there can't be a situation in a World Cup where it becomes relevant, there aren't enough games. In a way agreeing with your original point that the 'points are pointless'!

 

[rsgaz]

Isn't one win better than three draws?

Yes, only just!

 

[EFLImpudence]

If there is a team whose stats are 3 draws, then the other 3 teams in their group will all have at least one 'D' in their 3 games, won't they? And can therefore not finish with a win and two losses.

Not sure what you're getting at.

One of the other teams could have 2W & 1D, so 7 points.
With that another team will have 1W, 1D & 1L so 4 points.
That still works out my way.

Those are the ony two options assuming the other teams do not draw.

Should all the games be drawn except one, the team with the 1W will be the clear leader with 5 points or my way.

 

[rsgaz]

That still works out my way.

Yes, there just aren't enough games in the World Cup to produce a scenario where that doesn't work.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Going back to your example -

I must say that it seems a strange philosophy to settle a tie by virtue of fewer losses rather than more wins.

Were Real Madrid upset or are they just used to this odd system?

 

[Deleted member 63160]

Going back to your example -

I must say that it seems a strange philosophy to settle a tie by virtue of fewer losses rather than more wins.

Were Real Madrid upset or are they just used to this odd system?

They were earning millions for knocking a ball about...guess they manned up and took it on the chin, brave lil soldiers

 

[EFLImpudence]

That's not fair, they have to earn lots.

Tattooes and hairdressing are expensive.

Eighty quid the first time Beckham had his head shaved.

 

[Brigadier]

They were earning millions for knocking a ball about...guess they manned up and took it on the chin, brave lil soldiers

Real Madrid couldn't care less about the group stages: for them, it's win the whole thing, or nothing.
They've earned that privilege.

 

[KenGMac]

How about deducting parts of points for penalties and yellow cards Et-All??

Just a consideration