Poorly fitted sink

[raspin]

This forum seems to handle sink questions but this is not strictly a "plumbing" question. Forgive me if there's a better place.

My builder has poorly fitted a stainless steel sink during a kitchen refit. He has somehow left bolts pinching the rim and causing very visible impressions. Does this look right? How come the bolts have caused this? What was done wrong?

http://www.piponi.com/pages/kitchen/images/sinkdent1.jpg
http://www.piponi.com/pages/kitchen/images/sinkdent2.jpg
http://www.piponi.com/pages/kitchen/images/sinkdent3.jpg

These photos may not do justice to the botch, but they are very visible and ruin the clean look of the stainless steel. I am now trying to negotiate some fix but would love to know if I could explain how the builder has screwed up. It would give me better leverage. As it is he wants me to pay for a new sink if I want to replace it.

A second issue is that the rim does not touch the surface and leaves a gap. This seems very poor. Does this look correct? Surely it should be a tight fit.

http://www.piponi.com/pages/kitchen/images/sinkrim.jpg

Any help would be appreciated.

PS Here's the full story for context although not necessary for this query.

 

[Goldberg]

It's difficult to diagnose the cause without seeing the sink removed.

For example, it might just be a poor quality sink.

Or, the clamp screws were over-tightened.

Or, the hole was cut too large, and the sink thereby isn't sufficiently supported under the clamp tags.

 

[sooey]

I would have guessed that the hole was cut too small, and he's overtightened the clamps trying to pull the sink down into it.

 

[Goldberg]

Good call.

 

[raspin]

Appreciate the quick replies!

Yes, apologies I can't give you details of the fitting or take it apart - it's currently glued down.

Also yes, it is a quite a cheap sink.

Looking under the sink I don't think the hole is too big. Indeed I still have the piece of the worktop cut out and the template. Putting them together the cutout is about 1mm smaller than the template. I don't know if he trimmed back the hole further or whether the template caters for that millimetre, but there is a possibility the hole is too small. It would certainly make sense.

Therefore, maybe, mixing the poor sink quality with a slightly undersized hole he may have overtightened the screws to get the sink down. The gap indicates he may have had trouble doing this.

Do you think this fitting is poor enough to justify the builder carrying the cost of a fix? Not to mention the numerous scratches he's caused in the process (last link in my original post).

 

[Homesafe]

the hole may have been cut just a wee bit smaller and what he has done is bang the sink down into place and when tightened up the hooks show thro. the top.

thats my assumption from the pics

 

[Goldberg]

Also yes, it is a quite a cheap sink.

Hmm.

the cutout is about 1mm smaller than the template.

I would expect the piece removed from the worktop to be about 2mm less than the hole, because of the saw blade, so your hole doesn't sound too small or too big.

Do you think this fitting is poor enough to justify the builder carrying the cost of a fix? Not to mention the numerous scratches he's caused in the process (last link in my original post).

Why did you let a "builder" fit a kitchen sink anyway? That's asking for trouble.

 

[raspin]

Without seeing it, and assuming for a moment the problem is a small hole, if the sink was removed, the hole enlarged and then refitted and screwed properly, do you think those dents could be improved, or do you think those marks would remain?

I'm just trying to get an idea (scratches aside) whether the impressions have caused irreparable damage.

 

[Goldberg]

a) Unless the template doesn't match the sink, the hole can't be too small because the piece removed is only 1mm smaller than the template.

b) You'll never get the dents out completely.

 

[raspin]

Why did you let a "builder" fit a kitchen sink anyway? That's asking for trouble.

Well, I say builder, but he says he is an experienced kitchen fitter. But he has also poorly cut the worktop and poorly placed the extractor so I have since become more doubtful of his experience and skills.

a) Unless the template doesn't match the sink, the hole can't be too small because the piece removed is only 1mm smaller than the template.

Looking at the template again there's a possibility that one side is a lot further away from 1mm, but he may have trimmed the hole. But if it was slightly off, the sink may have gone in awkwardly and he may have got lost which side was too small and ended up tightening it up. This is all wild guesswork but I have some ideas for questions to put to him. I can't imagine if it was all done well that this sort of finish is "normal".

 

[Goldberg]

This is all wild guesswork but I have some ideas for questions to put to him. I can't imagine if it was all done well that this sort of finish is "normal".

Given that the finish is clearly abnormal and, in most people's opinions, poor, I think you're going about this the wrong way.

I would simply explain that you're unhappy about the dents in the sink, because there aren't dents in sinks in showrooms and in other people's kitchens. How he explains their appearance is up to him, but the explanation really doesn't matter because you're going to ask him to rectify it.

If he doesn't then rectify it, you're entitled to deduct from what you pay him the cost if getting someone else to rectify it.

If you haven't yet paid him, then this should work out fine.

If you have paid him, then why have you?

 

[big-all]

if you are measuring the cutout dont forget the the blade thickness that would certainly mean the hole was at least the right size but may of course be off centre causing it to pull against the framework or supports

 

[raspin]

I haven't paid him. I have already said to him I want it rectified but I know he's going to try to explain it as "normal" so I'm looking for opinion to give me some backup (if only in my own head) when I argue the case. I think you guys have now assured me I'm not being picky with the dents (and scratches).

But I'd like it amicably sorted so he can finish off those things more difficult to screw up irreparably.

Given that the finish is clearly abnormal and, in most people's opinions, poor, I think you're going about this the wrong way.

I would simply explain that you're unhappy about the dents in the sink, because there aren't dents in sinks in showrooms and in other people's kitchens. How he explains their appearance is up to him, but the explanation really doesn't matter because you're going to ask him to rectify it.

If he doesn't then rectify it, you're entitled to deduct from what you pay him the cost if getting someone else to rectify it.

If you haven't yet paid him, then this should work out fine.

If you have paid him, then why have you?

 

[Goldberg]

Fair play.