Oh dear oh dear...............
Posh loft conversion
- Thread starter semene
- Start date
Oh dear oh dear...............
/backs out of thread ........
he has not touched any of the roof structure he has even said we should collar tie the with 4 x2 the[/QUOTE]
Info from the builder
all the new joist are 6x2 cl 16 graded span is 2.3m on one side of loft and 2.4m and other side of the loft , both resting on internal load bearing walls on one side and fixed to the 9x3 beam on the other side with joist hangers.
The spacing between the the joists is the same as the old ceiling rafters 400mm,
9x3 is cl15 / other is cl 24 graded which are spanned 4.5m , he has then bolted the aprox 8x4 binder together with m12 blots and squre washer to the back of the 9x3 , the binder are the same height has the 9x3 beam i.e inch or so off the old ceiling rafter and the binders are cemented to the wall on one side.
He said that he has connected old ceiling rafter to the 9x3 beams with metal building band to stop the ceiling bowing and he said also connected them to new 6x2 at same spot were the old binder was removed again to stop the ceiling from bowing.
our main concern was the could the 9x3 snap if we put too much load on it?
Info from the builder
all the new joist are 6x2 cl 16 graded span is 2.3m on one side of loft and 2.4m and other side of the loft , both resting on internal load bearing walls on one side and fixed to the 9x3 beam on the other side with joist hangers.
The spacing between the the joists is the same as the old ceiling rafters 400mm,
9x3 is cl15 / other is cl 24 graded which are spanned 4.5m , he has then bolted the aprox 8x4 binder together with m12 blots and squre washer to the back of the 9x3 , the binder are the same height has the 9x3 beam i.e inch or so off the old ceiling rafter and the binders are cemented to the wall on one side.
He said that he has connected old ceiling rafter to the 9x3 beams with metal building band to stop the ceiling bowing and he said also connected them to new 6x2 at same spot were the old binder was removed again to stop the ceiling from bowing.
our main concern was the could the 9x3 snap if we put too much load on it?
The 9x3 won't 'snap', and that floor won't be going anywhere.
That's the straightforward bit.
There are a whole host of regs for loft conversions and your loft will simply not comply with Building Regs.
This will make it difficult if you sell, and will also invalidate your insurance.
That's the straightforward bit.
There are a whole host of regs for loft conversions and your loft will simply not comply with Building Regs.
This will make it difficult if you sell, and will also invalidate your insurance.
As Tony says, the 9x3 is probably not hugely undersized if it's bolted to an existing member and it's not expected to carry any roof load.
But so far you haven't told us if any purlin props have been removed. If they have been, the existing purlin supporting the rafters will sag and end up loading the 9x3 with roof load through the dwarf wall.
If purlin props have been removed the member will need to be strong enough to also support roof loads.
However, nothing is going to physically snap or even fail. Tony has pointed out the risks of non-compliance with building regs.
But so far you haven't told us if any purlin props have been removed. If they have been, the existing purlin supporting the rafters will sag and end up loading the 9x3 with roof load through the dwarf wall.
If purlin props have been removed the member will need to be strong enough to also support roof loads.
However, nothing is going to physically snap or even fail. Tony has pointed out the risks of non-compliance with building regs.
He has not touched any of the roof structure what so ever, he said the purlins are resting on brick support which are coming out from wall one side and chimney breast on the other side.
Nothing from the purlins was connected to the floor, he has suggested we have 4x2 collar tiles to tie the rafter at ridge, as he thinks sometime ago when roof was changed from slate to tiles but not extra support added.
He does not like the way the purlins are resting on the brickwork but he says thats how they built the houses back in Victorian times, any idea how he can make it stronger.
Classic
Nothing wrong with that - leave it alone.
If it hasn't moved in 100 years, it's probably not going anywhere soon...
If the new floor is supported mid span on the central wall below and they were full length 6X2" then the only problem I can see is the chip board flooring, if you want to make it stronger and bind it all together use real T&G wood flooring.
How long is the purlin? I have no SE basis for saying it needs supporting, but I have done god knows how many loft conversions and can't remember any purlins over more than about 3m that haven't been supported mid span, what size and length are the roof rafters. Just because your man hasn't taken them out doesn't mean they shouldn't be there.
Purlins usually indicate roof rafters that would otherwise be insufficient to span the whole length of the roof and themselves unless of short dimension need a support of their own to prevent sagging.
As our SE friends on here have said it's unlikely to completely fail, in fact I know of a fink trussed roof that had all the compression and tension cords cut out and held up for 15 plus years, but that doesn't mean it's right.
Quite clearly this isn't a "posh" conversion but a "posh" boarding out and I have seen much worse done, but will never be able to be classed as a habitable room.
Just a thought but but the OP mentioned a binder that had been bolted to the 9x3 was the same thickness but an inch smaller 8x3?), doesn't sound like any binder I have ever seen.
Purlins usually indicate roof rafters that would otherwise be insufficient to span the whole length of the roof and themselves unless of short dimension need a support of their own to prevent sagging.
As our SE friends on here have said it's unlikely to completely fail, in fact I know of a fink trussed roof that had all the compression and tension cords cut out and held up for 15 plus years, but that doesn't mean it's right.
Quite clearly this isn't a "posh" conversion but a "posh" boarding out and I have seen much worse done, but will never be able to be classed as a habitable room.
Just a thought but but the OP mentioned a binder that had been bolted to the 9x3 was the same thickness but an inch smaller 8x3?), doesn't sound like any binder I have ever seen.
Purlin is about 4m , rafter size is 4 x 2 length is around approx 4m, binder is aprox 7 1/2 x 3 see pic
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