Potterton Kingfisher Mf CFL 70

[stevecaner3546]

You seem to be fixated with your controller.

You also switch your controller OFF and then instead of back to auto you decide to create a different situation by using the boost + 1 hour instead. To diagnose faults you have to be consistent in your tests and not introduce new senarios

I am still not convinced of any fault apart from the boiler failing after about 20 min, but earlier you seemed to think it would run normally for hours on end if you selected a particular setting on the programmer

I am presuming that the +1 hour simply switches everything on as AUTO would but perhaps I am wrong.

It appears to be kicked back into life when auto is Off then On again after 20 mins.

I am not fixated by the controller as I generally have faith in electronics and I do believe that something is wrong with the boiler it's just that the other day the water wouldn't switch off and that is why I reset the thing so I could reset the times on and off - that's all but now it only fires the boiler up when the HW is engaged (as well as the CH) but HW runs solo and the boiler still plays up.

Looking at the fitting and settup manual I see that HW can only be on either SOLO or when CH is called for on my system as it has two valves and one is controlled by the tank thermostat (HW) and the other (CH) by the controller (CH off).

As I said I will go through all your advice tomorrow (better than watching TV) and report back.

Thanks for all your help on Christmas day - it has been interesting learning much more about my heating system..... I really do appreciate your efforts.

If I ignore your own thoughts, are you able to view the pilot flame when it starts up normally and also when its in the fault condition?

Pilot light up Ok and I can view it through the little window. When boiler burner fires up green indicator comes on. When main burner goes out and the fan is still running the pilot is still alight - I don't think it the fan and pilot should be operating if the boiler is shut down because of room stat or water temp.

I will test to see if it plays up on HW only as well.
Regards

Steve

 

[bengasman]

As Tony said: if you keep doing different things, it is all but impossible to find out where exactly it is going wrong. It would help if you actually followed the instructions and report back what happens.

 

[twgas]

Sorry, I can't help any more on this, you don't seem capable of giving a yes or no answer and as such just make asking questions a waste of time - good luck with it.

 

[Agile]

Confusing as you seem to be making it, I would like to suggest that you have two faults!

Could you ignore the controller and see if you can convince yourself that I could be right and see if your system indeed behaves as if those were the faults?

Fault 1. The CH valve does not produce a call for heat.

Fault 2. The boiler loses flame detection, leaves the pilot light on and it then runs the ignition SPARK continually even though the flame is on.

In the case of Fault 1, the system will run if the CH is selected and the HW is calling for heat BUT IT WILL SHUT DOWN in that case if the cylinder stat is turned down below the tank temperature. Try that.

In the case of Fault 2, if you look very closely you may be able to see it still sparking. This would need to be investigated by an RGI and could be associated with the detection electrode and lead but more probably as a result of a faulty PCB.

Tony Glazier

 

[stevecaner3546]

as I dont like to see people cold, especially, at this time of year, I'll try to help. but I need straight answers to simple questions (to save confusion).

Start by turning HW(hot water) AND CH(central heating) off at the programmer.
Turn the room 'stat up to the highest possible setting.
Turn CH on at prog.
does the CH valve move(open) and does the boiler light up.

Right... Programmer set to AUTO for both HW & CH on & off at same times. From COLD - programmer switched off at mains switch - Room stat set at 27C. Turned Programmer on at mains switch - wife said both HW & CH lights lit and I watched CH valve move to OPEN. Boiler fired up as it should - fan came on for 1 minute then main burners lit - Rads heated up and we have had HW & CH as usual since 08:00.

I haven't touched anything else and will leave it alone and see if it goes off @ 12:00 and back on @ 13:30 and works as it has done this morning until 15:30 when the next OFF occurs.

Keeping my fingers crossed..... But (please don't moan) I looked at a Reader's Digest DIY aid manual my neighbour lent me and that mentions that if the Boiler pilot lights and the fan is running but no main burners light then it said look at a pressure switch. I am NOT touching the boiler as I am not qualified even though I can do most things (engineer by trade) but is this something possible at fault. The book also mentioned that a temporary fix is to cycle the boiler on and off several time to see if the switch "unsticks". Obviously by switching it on and off since Friday could this have freed a sticky switch?

Steve

 

[bengasman]

...Right... Programmer set to AUTO for both HW & CH on & off at same times.

Why do you ask advice from professionals that do this for a living, and then ignore what they tell you?

I looked at a Reader's Digest DIY aid manual my neighbour lent me and that mentions that if the Boiler pilot lights and the fan is running but no main burners light then it said look at a pressure switch.

Why do you ask advice from professionals that do this for a living, and then follow the advice in a diy book? (which, incidentally, is incorrect)

I think I am going to give up on this one.

 

[twgas]

...Right... Programmer set to AUTO for both HW & CH on & off at same times.

Why do you ask advice from professionals that do this for a living, and then ignore what they tell you?

I looked at a Reader's Digest DIY aid manual my neighbour lent me and that mentions that if the Boiler pilot lights and the fan is running but no main burners light then it said look at a pressure switch.

Why do you ask advice from professionals that do this for a living, and then follow the advice in a diy book? (which, incidentally, is incorrect)

I think I am going to give up on this one.

beat you to it on this one Ben

 

[Nige F]

OP is from Sussex - what you expect Shame I`m not Gas Safe

 

[stevecaner3546]

...Right... Programmer set to AUTO for both HW & CH on & off at same times.

Why do you ask advice from professionals that do this for a living, and then ignore what they tell you?

I looked at a Reader's Digest DIY aid manual my neighbour lent me and that mentions that if the Boiler pilot lights and the fan is running but no main burners light then it said look at a pressure switch.

Why do you ask advice from professionals that do this for a living, and then follow the advice in a diy book? (which, incidentally, is incorrect)

I think I am going to give up on this one.

Yes you do that if you have no more idea as to why this problem might be caused - you obviously didn't read or understand what I wrote. I said that I read that this problem can be attributed to a "faulty pressure switch" and asked if this was a possibility. Not can some idiot rant and rave at me.

For your information I have followed the instructions to the letter here and the system ran semmingly Ok until about 19:00 (7pm) when the boiler main burner went out but the fan kept running.

The boiler thermostat had no effect whatsoever but what did have and effect was when I switched the power off to the controller and switched it on the Boiler fired us as it should do.

When this problem happens the boiler potentiometer (thermostat control) has no effect except to kill power when in the OFF position. When moved back to normal temperature the problem continues.

I'll live with it for now and wait for a professional that 'hopefull' know how to fix it.


Weird.

I thank all of you that have given me good advice and this seems to have kept us warm(ish) over the Holiday period. When an engineer is available to call I'll let him/her deal with the problem.

To those that have decided to insult me --------- you know what you can do.

Steve

 

[stevecaner3546]

To all the folks that have given me advice with my on-going heating problem a great big thank you and have a great new year.

Developments as of to-day are that I have now been told that this problem is probably due to the hot-water storage tank coil being corroded or broken. The plumber said that as it's a fully pumped indirect vented system the water shut-off valve is working Ok but the CH pressure from the pump is forcing water into the tank via the return to the boiler as there is now no resistance.

Seems logical to me except for the £1000 estimate to replace the tank. What are they these days - gold plated?

Steve

 

[spraggo]

Seems logical to me except for the £1000 estimate to replace the tank. What are they these days - gold plated?

Steve

It seems logical to me for you to get a second oppinion and quote, is it a sealed system or open vent?. If the latter I would check that there is water in the small head tank in the attic, if not it could be that the cylinder coil is air locked.

 

[twgas]

Developments as of to-day are that I have now been told that this problem is probably due to the hot-water storage tank coil being corroded or broken.

can't see that being the cause.

Seems logical to me except for the £1000 estimate to replace the tank. Steve

With all due respect you know little about heating systems so it may sound logical to you, £1000 is pretty expensive for a normal cylinder, if it's unvented not so bad.

 

[twgas]

If you still want/need help I'm willing to give it another go, but I do NOT want your opinions or guesses at what may, or may not, happen.
If you follow instructions and answer questions with a yes or no, we might just get somewhere.

 

[stevecaner3546]

OP is from Sussex - what you expect Shame I`m not Gas Safe

Wrong again. OP lives in Sussex but hails from SE London so not a dumb-wit like the natives - not Polish either.

 

[twgas]

where ever the OP is from he needs help, maybe a call to a boiler repair man will be his best bet.