Questions for a new build

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I will be building an extension in my back garden. It will essentially be a workshop and will have a CNC, lathe, some welding gear and so on. I have a few questions I hope someone would be most kind to answer:

1. The wiring from the property to the detached garage will need to be armoured, but how deep will it need to be placed in the ground?

2. I have a single phase setup, with the standard 240v, 100amp at the mains. The plan is to get a sparky in to run a cable from the house CU to a separate CU in the garage. My concern is considering the tools and equipment I will have, should I be concerned about not having enough juice to run the machinery?

3. Will the armoured T&E need to be run through a conduit when running under the ground? (I suspect it will)
 
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I will be building an extension in my back garden. It will essentially be a workshop and will have a CNC, lathe, some welding gear and so on. I have a few questions I hope someone would be most kind to answer:

1. The wiring from the property to the detached garage will need to be armoured, but how deep will it need to be placed in the ground?

2. I have a single phase setup, with the standard 240v, 100amp at the mains. The plan is to get a sparky in to run a cable from the house CU to a separate CU in the garage. My concern is considering the tools and equipment I will have, should I be concerned about not having enough juice to run the machinery?

3. Will the armoured T&E need to be run through a conduit when running under the ground? (I suspect it will)

SWA cable can be buried directly in the ground. Ideally at least 600mm deep, bedded on sand, with marking tape above.

Armoured T and E isn't a thing.

Your electrician will determine the loads and design, install and test the installation appropriately. Are you using an electrician or doing it yourself?
 
Is it an extension or detached garage? :cautious:

1. Have a read of this: https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Book/7.13.3.htm

2. Do you know the rating of the tools and equipment you have already or plan to get? It's unlikely you will struggle with 100a unless you plan on cooking a Sunday roast, having a shower and operating multiple machinery at the same time. I assume you will be only using 1 potentially high current power tool at a time + an extractor.

3. No conduit needed but might help in future to run additional cables etc... between the two buildings.
 
It will essentially be a workshop and will have a CNC, lathe, some welding gear and so on.
Someone is bound to say it, so it might as well be me ... Are you aware of the fact that you are contractually required to get permission from your Distribution Network Operator to install welding equipment or other high-load machinery (I'm not sure whether any of your would qualify as the latter)??

Kind Regards, John
 
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3. Will the armoured T&E need to be run through a conduit when running under the ground? (I suspect it will)

Armoured cable for a house would tend to be called just 2 core or 3 core

2 core if seperate cores used for live and neutral, the steel armour used as an earth
3 core, if seperate cores used for live neutral and one as earth, usually with the armoured also connected to earth.

Having a water supply to the building may also affect the earthing requirements
 
I will be building an extension in my back garden.
When you apply for Building Regulations approval, what will you tell Building Control, or allow them by default to assume, will be the way that you will ensure compliance with Part P?

Nobody here is a Building Regulations enforcer, but be aware that if you tell them one thing and then go and do another you could end up with grief.

The first thing you should do is to look at their website and see what their attitude, procedures, and charges are for the following alternatives:
  • Have it all done by a registered electrician.
  • Have it all done by a qualified but unregistered electrician.
  • Have it done by someone who is not registered or qualified (e.g. you) and using Building Control to inspect & test.
  • Have it done by someone who is not registered or qualified (e.g. you) and using a registered 3rd party certifier to inspect & test.
 
Someone is bound to say it, so it might as well be me ... Are you aware of the fact that you are contractually required to get permission from your Distribution Network Operator to install welding equipment or other high-load machinery (I'm not sure whether any of your would qualify as the latter)??
whssign.gif


Scoffing at that would be a bad idea - your supply agreement with them says you must consult them - if you don't and if as a result you cause problems for your neighbours, the DNO will come in and disconnect you and NGAS.
 
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about having your supply disconnected. Heavy loads cause voltage drops in the network, this affects your neighbours, they reoprt problems with flickering lights and similar effects. DNO investigate and you get a warning to stop using the equipment. Ignore it and they disconnect you.
 
House deeds often have limitations, mothers house can't keep chickens for example, and businesses run from house are very limited, often Doctor, Dentist, and Solicitor is allowed, but not much else.

But be it keeping caravans in the garden or any other thing officially not allowed, in the main it needs some one to complain first. So there are things you can do to minimise disruption to other people, using inverter welding machines, and inverter drives can reduce the start up loads and with it the dimming of lights etc. Not only will they reduce the start loads they will also reduce cable size required. So step one is to find out what you want to run with start up loads in mind. No one can simply say you need a 16mm² cable to weld with, they have to know what welder you are using.

I found a standard welder runs on 25 volt plus 1 volt per 25 amp so a 100 amp welder will be around 29 volt and a 200 amp welder around 33 volt. You need the volts to work out current, so 100 x 29 = 2900 VA divide by 230 volt = 12.6A so about the maximum from a 13A outlet, at 200 amp = 28.7A at 230 volt. This is approximate but it gives you something to work with. So welding using TIG or MIG is not that much of a problem, normally below 100 amp and normally an inverter as want a DC supply. Stick welding is another kettle of fish.

As to lathe well using an inverter also gives speed control to some extent so one designed to work with an inverter can have less mechanical speed control, this is all well and good when looking at a new lathe, but looking at an old Milford 7 some mods would be required to convert to inverter control, here it depends on your skill, to be frank every inverter seems to have different instructions so even an electrician has to follow the instruction book, but few inverters are less than £100 many are around the £500 plus you would want a 3 phase 230 volt motor, smaller motors tend to be 230 volt delta and 400 volt star so a three phase lathe may be able to run on 230 volt three phase from an inverter. Normally you need an inverter per motor not one inverter to run the lot.

Until you have weighed up pros and cons of inverters you will not know how much power you need. Likely you will only use one machine at a time, so only really interested in the biggest power user, again since you will likely get volt drop and you have rotating machinery you need to consider lighting, many LED and fluorescent lights can cause a stroboscopic effect. So likely you will want HF fluorescent or DC LED lighting. The HF fluorescent normally has a large voltage range some can be 85 ~ 250 volt although most will not drop that low, so again this all relates to cable size, and volt drop.

Distance will also effect volt drop.

Although a piece of string which runs in the centre of a cable is 185.2 meters long, not all bits of string are that long, so we talk about the length of a piece of string as being in the main an unknown quantity, it's the same with your question, although we could guess that 6mm² SWA cable will likely do the job, in real terms we don't know. And it is likely a balance between what you pay for your equipment and what you pay for the installation.

Location is also important, if your house is close to a large transformer then your equipment may not cause any noticeable volt drop. However if supplied from a pole mounted transformer it could be a massive problem. The loop impedance or prospective short circuit current would give one a clue, but this is really a job for some one on site, not people on a forum.
 

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