rear extension quotes, deluded about expectations?

[John D v2.0]

Well I also told you to Ditch the bifolds and ufh to save money and I wasn't having a laugh! But it's a shame but you have to make a choice and want to do it. Don't care too much about house prices unless you're going to move soon, just think what you can afford and the result you want.

 

[masamune]

I always think of any work as a % of the "value" of a property.

I agree and having put figures together for a number of future cases I was not convinced that projected figures would provide a return to cover the costs for the location. I could be wrong but I am not ready to wipe out my bank account just to break even in a few years. The problem is that a house like this will not offer more expansion potential.

What would you consider as a reasonable percentage of the property value on a rear extension for the area you live? Just curious. Btw I have no idea about Sussex

 

[masamune]

Well I also told you to Ditch the bifolds and ufh to save money and I wasn't having a laugh! But it's a shame but you have to make a choice and want to do it. Don't care too much about house prices unless you're going to move soon, just think what you can afford and the result you want.

I have difficulty understanding how taking out 6.5k would make 100k figure more feasible. Even if we removed those "expensive" elements (UFH being more of a luxury according to some) you would still need doors and windows to the garden, plus heating. The doors and windows will cost a fair bit of money and heating requires extending the pipes and buying/fitting radiators, so labour and materials are still there. Even though this would be cheaper, the actual saving is far less than assumed. I hope you agree that it still makes not much difference to a 100k figure, although my point in the other post was about the ridiculous figure.

And just to add insult to the injury the same guy argued I am spending too much on the kitchen. So a mere 17% of the project budget was allocated on the kitchen from joinery and appliances to fitting inclusive. I can 't help but think the guy had no idea of what the scope of a "kitchen extension" means, let alone of a decent kitchen. How come I didn't think of that, should spend 100k on bricks and mortar, then fit an IKEA kitchen ...

 

[John D v2.0]

Taking them out would save on the cheaper quotes too! Radiators are really cheap I found, and the window company we used recommended the sliding doors but admittedly still half the price of bi folds.
For us, even 5k is a lot of money to me, 5k is 5k regardless, but if you're doing it as an investment maybe different rules apply and you have to work on percentages? We probably saved 30k perhaps with these small changes and diy, but percentage wise that's not a majority.
Anyway sound like you're happy you've made the right decision (although not what you hoped) so best of luck!

 

[noseall]

and remember you're handing over your life savings for someone to destroy your house and make everything you own filthy. And if it's winter you'll be cold too!

Charming. We have tried magic wands but they are unreliable. So muck and bullets it is.

You're not a banker are you?

 

[John D v2.0]

Charming. We have tried magic wands but they are unreliable. So muck and bullets it is.

You're not a banker are you?

Sorry that was extremely tongue in cheek, of course it's the after result you're really paying for
And no not a banker.. Unless that's a euphemism? I'm just an enthusiastic diyer!

 

[cjard]

. How come I didn't think of that, should spend 100k on bricks and mortar, then fit an IKEA kitchen ...

I think you might be making the typical mistake of "it doesn't cost a lot of money, ergo it must be a turd" there. I realise Londoners have a somewhat warped perspective on value, but really what Ikea charge for a kitchen is getting towards what a kitchen SHOULD cost, given that it's little more than a collection of chipboard cabinets with fancy painted doors.
When you visit the local boutique kitchens place and they quote you 10k for 20 cupboards, no vat, no worktops, no fitting, no appliances, no taps, no delivery stand back for a moment and look at each of the chipboard boxes your 500 quid buys you and think "if this was a bedside cabinet or a dining table, made of plastic coated crushed up glued together wood, would I pay 500 quid for it?"

Probably not!


John: 3500k/sqm is mental. I'm balking at having spent 700 quid a sqm on my conversion, though I could have shaved that down somewhat by not having glazed oak doors, hardwood skirting, bespoke tiling and staircases, networked lighting/heating (underfloor), 5 sets of bifolding doors, 60sqm of roof glazing, granite worktops and Siemens/Bosch appliances. What on earth did you specify to spend six times more than I did?

 

[John D v2.0]

I've not heard anyone managing 700 a square metre, especially in London ! But you've done well.
ours was pushed up by 5 steels, of which 2 on existing outside walls, also rebuilding most of the roof, removing 2 chimneys completely, and rebuilding an internal load bearing wall in a new position downstairs.
Definitely didn't get the best cost for the area, could have covered the whole garden with a box on the back for less! But we weren't after that.

 

[masamune]

Taking them out would save on the cheaper quotes too! Radiators are really cheap I found, and the window company we used recommended the sliding doors but admittedly still half the price of bi folds.
For us, even 5k is a lot of money to me, 5k is 5k regardless, but if you're doing it as an investment maybe different rules apply and you have to work on percentages? We probably saved 30k perhaps with these small changes and diy, but percentage wise that's not a majority.
Anyway sound like you're happy you've made the right decision (although not what you hoped) so best of luck!

I don't think I wrote anywhere that 5k would be a small amount of money, it was compared to the building cost. But as you concluded there is no massive saving from ditching some of important quality "fixed price" elements from the work. You still have to provide alternatives. I am not thinking of an indoor swimming pool

I would rather fit good quality doors and windows on my extension, all the existing PVC has warped. But honestly, would you want to spend 80k on the project and save on the 5k from the glazing to fit cheaper ones?

I would rather not make a virtual saving and pay it more down the line.

You compensated with your own DIY on the labour, which is an inflexible cost. What you achieved is great but not an option for me. Firstly because I don't believe an average person can DIY at a competent level that would match the skill of a seasoned tradesman. The other issue is that I cannot guarantee my work and if it goes pear shaped, it could cost me dearly in the project timeline.

You have to draw a line on what is actually worth keeping or cutting, it is not a case of just building an extension no matter what.
I don't know if I made the right choice. At least to me there is no point spending all my money on the building and cutting out some quality elements that would the place to my liking.

 

[John D v2.0]

I'm not disagreeing with you, I'm just putting things in perspective! Good luck!
Edit - PS we went for aluminum and timber rear screen using a Danish triple glazed system, so certainly not cheap UPvC.

 

[Ian H]

How about getting the house valued as it is and see if moving house could be an option?

 

[masamune]

I think you might be making the typical mistake of "it doesn't cost a lot of money, ergo it must be a turd" there. "

I think not, a 4 page spreadsheet including fixed costs up to spurs and sockets, plus 5 pages of detailed project scope give me a good picture of the amount of work involved. I doubt most people would bother doing this much. It is really a personal choice, if you are ok spending 100k for a 20m2 building cost alone on a small 3 bed-semi...

I realise Londoners have a somewhat warped perspective on value, but really what Ikea charge for a kitchen is getting towards what a kitchen SHOULD cost, given that it's little more than a collection of chipboard cabinets with fancy painted doors.

Stereotyping people is not particularly useful, not born in London for what it's worth. The cost of a kitchen is the same across the country last time I checked. IKEA kitchens in the better ranges are indeed more expensive than 10 years ago.

Kitchens are certainly a collection of chipboard melamine cabinets with fancy doors, I would not argue that. But I also find there are different qualities. IKEA lacquer looks cr*p for example and I don't like their mechanisms and limited range as a matter of personal taste. Kitchens though have no void at the back of the cabinets for pipework and wiring last time I heard. It may be different now. IKEA furniture is not bad at all in general. The kitchen is something personal you use every day for many years and also an element of luxury.

Even doors come with certain qualities as silly as it may sound. The chipboard is compressed and glued better, the edge chamfering and finish, range of colours and sizes, everything counts towards the overall quality. I would certainly not categorise IKEA hinges as Blum. I think it is a matter of personal taste, I would not try to go stingy on the kitchen but avoid overspending. e.g "Would you like a hot water tap for 600?", I think not, there is a kettle.

Anyway, I have not suggested I was buying a Pedini that would cost half my extension budget. My kitchen is not that big anyway and while still the main element of the project, the cost is reasonable for size of extension and above average german maker. With Siemens appliances, quartz worktops and fitting came at approx 16k. The joinery/mechanisms were about 8k with VAT.

John: 3500k/sqm is mental. I'm balking at having spent 700 quid a sqm on my conversion,

John's figure is mental but yours is crazy on the lower end. At least you would not be able to work with that near London. How much of the work did you do by yourself? We want to see photos

 

[masamune]

I'm not disagreeing with you, I'm just putting things in perspective! Good luck!
Edit - PS we went for aluminum and timber rear screen using a Danish triple glazed system, so certainly not cheap UPvC.

Yes, me too. Hope it didn't sound like arguing, just replied spontaneously on some thoughts. Besides you have had a real experience and thanks for sharing

 

[masamune]

How about getting the house valued as it is and see if moving house could be an option?

That is a plan B for the future but not the immediate one.

It would be interesting to hear more figures, details from people in the vicinity of outter London.

 

[noseall]

£700 per sq/m is unrealistic anywhere.