Replacing Sockets, Advice Needed Please.

[pyschometal]

Hi All,

I am going to replace all switches and sockets throughout my home.

Here are some pictures to show you how it looks now...

Quite the eyesore! and they are like that althrough the house.

Anyway, my problem is this.....

I removed the socket and the box to mark the wall to put in the new backing boxes, only to discover that there are backing boxes already inside the wall. They are single socket backing boxes.
Now I have tried everything to get them out but the will just not budge, almost as if they have been cemented into place, and I am starting to damage the wall more than I have skill to repair. I now know why they just stuck the new sockets over the top of the holes in the wall!

Now here is my suggestion, but I am not sure if it will work.

The old single socket backing boxes are located very deep into the wall, maybe to far if you ask me, but would it be possible for me to just chisel away at the front edges of the hole into a funnel shape large enough for the new face to sink into with breathing room at the back and then screw the new face directly onto the wall?

I am sorry if that sounded like a stupid unsafe idea, but although I know a fair bit about wiring, I don't know anything about mounting and fitting electrical sockets.

Any advice would be great.

Many Thanks.

pyschometal

 

[sparkybird]

Hi there

Sorry to hear about your woes! What sort of property do you have, is it a purpose built flat by any chance?

It sounds like your flat might be wired through steel conduit, which could explain why it's so difficult to get the box out of the wall. Have another look in the single back box - are the cables twin and earth or, more likely, singles? Can you see a metal 'pipe' connected to the back box?

If this is the case you've got two hopes - bob hope and no hope. If you want flush sockets it'll be a rewire.

I'm not sure I get the drift of your suggestion - won't the sockets then be half in and half out of the wall? You also need to make sure that the steel conduit is not acting as your earth (quite common) as this could make things more complicated in fitting any new sockets.

You might be able to live with them, eh??

let me know what you find

SB

 

[pyschometal]

Thanks for the reply sparkybird.

Yes, on closer inspection there is a metal pipe at the back of the box, but I cannot see where it is connected.

As for my suggestion, What I meant was, leave the original single socket backing box where it is, Then chisel out the wall a few inches at the front, so the new double socket face is against the wall with the teminals at the back now being inside the wall, but obviously not touching anything and having room to breath, Then simply screw the new socket face directly onto the wall.

I just thought it was a easy solution, because the old metal backing box is a good 6 inches deep into the wall.

Many Thanks.

pyschometal

 

[sparkybird]

I wouldn't recommend that - the connection terminals in the back of your socket need to be protected from the dust and stuff in your wall, so that is the reason we put in metal boxes. It would also be difficult to fix the socket front to the wall.

However, if your original socket is 6" deep, can you not fit your new double box in front of this, bringing your cables through a knock out in the back of the box? A back box is only 25mm deep, so should be room. Make sure you use 20mm grommets (round rubber 'polos') to protect the cable from the sharp edges of the box knockout.

I am a bit concerned about the earthing though. Can you shave anouther look and let me know how the earth cable (yellow/green) is connected from your orignal box to the new surface mounted socket?

SB

 

[Adam_151]

You could fit these: http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/pro.jsp?cId=A331914&ts=01397&id=12849

Or you could make a bit of a mess of the wall and swap the backboxes and plaster up afterwards

Screwing the sockets directly to the wall overhanging a single backbox is a no no

 

[sparkybird]

Hi Adam

How's it going? See you got your 16th, then!

If the place is wired in steel conduit, there's no way he'll get the box out without major demolition and the possibility of cable damage. Your suggestion of the slimline socket front/box looks like a good idea!

best
SB

 

[Adam_151]

Yeah, a little ****ed off I only got 49/50 tho

My 2330 L2 red stripe cert came today(was a little supprised, didn't realise all the practical assement things had been sent off by the college yet)

As to the conduit installtion, yes its going to make a bit of a mess as you are going to need room to move it down and tilt it out, but I can't imagine it being a impossible task

Maybe its a female thing, I call it a 'bit of mess' you see it as more than that

 

[JohnD]

I'd be interested to see a pic of what's behind that surface socket.

Might spark off some ideas.

 

[Softus]

...the old metal backing box is a good 6 inches deep into the wall.

6" is a very long way - are you sure about this?

 

[plugwash]

you can also get converter sockets that give you a double socket straight from a single backbox, they stick out more than a normal flush socket but much less than a normal surface socket/box combination.

 

[securespark]

What if the conduit is the cpc?

Then butchering is not an option.

But of the original boxes are deep in the wall, I can't see a problem with flush-mounting a new box on top of the old one, providing there is a secure connection between them to carry the earth connection through, supplemented by a link.

 

[sparkydude]

If that was the case Securespark then yes your solution would work, but what he is proposing to do is chisel the brickwork out at the side of the boxes and then screw the socket directly to the brickwork, not to a metal box. I would recommend using converta sockets made by clipsal and others, these screw straight to a single flush box and only stick out about 15mm as opposed to 45mm with a surface box.

Heres a link to the clipsal ones

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/CLIPSAL-CONVE...ryZ57215QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem

nick

 

[JohnD]

picture! picture!

 

[ColJack]

if it's in conduit, then it should be simple enough to pull a single 2.5 earth in from socket to socket..

I'd get a sparky in and he'll do it for you..

20 mins a socket with a good hammer drill and chisel..

if the actual metal backbox is 6 inches deep then sinking a double in front of it is not an option..

 

[Softus]

Am I the only one who thinks that this claim of being six inches deep is crazy talk?