Selling 2014 house, DIY electrics - any inspection/certificate needed?

[garmcqui]

Hi all,

Our house (built 2014) is on the market, and have a few viewings scheduled. I'm just wondering, there are a few minor additions to the electrics which I have made myself (I consider myself competent, others may not!), such as a few spurred sockets, outdoor security light and an outdoor socket. No testing was done, other than an earth continuity check.

I understand none of these are notifiable, however am just wondering what I need to do to ensure it is all compliant for selling etc?

Thanks in advance.

Gareth

 

[JohnW2]

I understand none of these are notifiable, however am just wondering what I need to do to ensure it is all compliant for selling etc?

When you get to the stage of conveyancing, you will be asked if any electrical work has been undertaken since 1st January 2005 and, if so, will be asked for the relevant documentation (some of the things 'asked for' on standard conveyancing forms either don't exist or else are not relevant to non-notifiable work).

If, as I presume is the case, there is no documentation, you can just say so and leave a prospective buyer to 'do with that as they wish'. Theoretically, any electrical work (including DIY, and whether notifiable or not) should result in a certificate - either an Electrical Installation Certificate (EIC) or a 'Minor Works' certificate. If you did the work, you could produce such certificates yourself, but it is unlikely that you would have the necessary test equipment to complete all the bits relating to tests.

Any other approach is outside of the law, so it is not appropriate to comment on that here. In the final analysis, a serious buyer should not be put off by minor electrical DIY work - and, if they were really concerned, they could commission an inspection of the electrical installation (at their cost). My advice would be not to let them have any price reduction as a result of any of this.

I would suspect that a high proportion of house sales involve electrical work for which the documentation has either been lost or never existed, and that doesn't stop the houses being sold.

Kind Regards, John

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Whatever you do, don't give false answers to the questions - you don't want to be turning an inconsequential lack of paperwork into fraud by misrepresentation.

Anyway - you never know your luck - the form might only ask about notifiable work.

 

[JohnW2]

The TA6s I've seen don't seem to understand the difference between notifiable and non-notifiable work (for electrics or anything else) and, judging by the sort of documents they ask for (often by incorrect names) they may well think that everything is notifiable!

As I've often explained, I see a lot of houses being bought and sold. It is very common (and understandable in many cases) for the answer to the question about 'electrical work since 1/1/2005' to be "Not known", and even more common for documents not to be available if the answer to the question is "yes" - but I don't think that those things have ever, in themselves, been a reason for failure of a sale/purchase or for trying to negotiate a price reduction (or accepting a price reduction for that reason).

 

[ban-all-sheds]

The TA6s I've seen don't seem to understand the difference between notifiable and non-notifiable work (for electrics or anything else) and, judging by the sort of documents they ask for (often by incorrect names) they may well think that everything is notifiable!

Well - when I was curious recently about the exact wording I looked at the Law Society one, on the grounds that it was likely to be as "official" as there is.

The wording used in Section 4, and the Explanatory Notes make it look as if, with their form at least, it would be correct to answer it on the basis of notifiable work.

 

[garmcqui]

Thanks all.

Playing it safe, if I were to ring a sparky and ask him to come and inspect a few things, whatbis it I need to ask for?

Does he/she have to inspect the entire property, or only the diy work?

Any rough estimates of cost?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Playing it safe, if I were to ring a sparky and ask him to come and inspect a few things, whatbis it I need to ask for?

An Electrical Installation Condition Report.

Does he/she have to inspect the entire property, or only the diy work?

At this point the whole thing, I expect, but you could ask her to pay more attention to the DIY bits.

Any rough estimates of cost?

In the low hundreds. And, quite honestly, money down the drain wrt selling the house.

 

[JohnW2]

Playing it safe, if I were to ring a sparky and ask him to come and inspect a few things, whatbis it I need to ask for?

It's obviously up to you but, as I've said, my advice would be not to bother. Just be honest with any prospective buyer - and, if they are concerned, let them commision (and pay for) whatever inspection they would like.

Does he/she have to inspect the entire property, or only the diy work?

He/she would inspect (and test) however little or much of the installation you asked to be inspected - but see above.

Kind Regards, John

 

[SimonH2]

I concur - just answer the questions honestly and let the buyer decide what they want to to. TBH, it's getting to the stage now where seeing no electrical work reported as having been done is more of an issue than seeing that there has been some but no paperwork. We're already to the stage of it being 18 years - no electrical work on a house in 18 years, starting to sound a bit suspicious and as a minimum it will mean the installation is almost certainly not to current standards (mainly down to lack of RCDs.)
And of course, as that length of time increases, the more often the house will have changed ownership at least once already - and the answer is going to be "don't know". Makes the whole question a bit pointless.
As to missing paperwork, regardless of the notes on certificates warning that "this is an important document" - I bet more of them are lost than get passed one to the next owner.

 

[JohnW2]

And of course, as that length of time increases, the more often the house will have changed ownership at least once already - and the answer is going to be "don't know". Makes the whole question a bit pointless. ... As to missing paperwork, regardless of the notes on certificates warning that "this is an important document" - I bet more of them are lost than get passed one to the next owner.

Indeed. As I wrote above, with all the houses I see being bought and sold, the most common answert to the question about electrical work in the last ~13 years (not 18 years) is "Don't Know" and, when the answer is "yes" it is far more common that documentation is not available than that it is available.

Kind Regards, John

 

[ban-all-sheds]

How can someone not know if they have done, or had done, electrical work?

 

[JohnW2]

People are not always honest but, if they are being honest, a house owner will obviously normally (dementia etc. apart) know whether or not electrical work has been undertaken during the period of their ownership. However, if they know the answer to that is 'no', if they did not own the house on 1/1/2005, they will often not know whether electrical work had been undertaken "since 1/1/2005", in which case they have no option but to answer "Don't Know" to that question.
A lot of the houses I see being bought are not being sold by an owner but, rather, by such people as Executors, Beneficiaries, Mortgage Lenders or Insolvency Practitioners etc. In such cases, "Don't Know" tends to be the rule, rather than the exception and, of course, when it comes to re-selling the house (usually very quickly) it will still be "Don't know" in relation to anything other than any work done between the times of purchase and re-sale..

 

[ban-all-sheds]

if they did not own the house on 1/1/2005, they will often not know whether electrical work had been undertaken "since 1/1/2005", in which case they have no option but to answer "Don't Know" to that question.

Looks like another case where they should have, if not used, taken a cue from the Law Society one, which says in the instructions to the buyer

 

[JohnW2]

That obviously makes sense but, if that is the guidance, the question should probably be re-worded so that "what it actually asks" is answerable (other than with "Don't Know") by far more people.
As Simon has said, the question is going to get increasing silly as we get further and further from 1/1/2005. Maybe it should ask about work undertaken during the seller's period of ownership?

 

[EFLImpudence]

Surely the question was introduced merely to justify and validate the notification and self-certification (self-notification) procedure and Schemes.

Only the electrician has a copy of the certificates issued, so if one receives them and throws them away, there is no way to find them if the identity of the electrician is not known or disclosed.
I presume the Local Authority or Schemes keep a record of their certificates of Completion or Compliance but (in England now) all they will state is 'New circuit', 'Replacement of consumer unit' or 'Addition or alteration of existing circuits in a special location'. They have no details of the work done.

What would be the point of having a driving licence if no record of its issue was kept and no one was ever asked to produce it?