Shoddy Tradesmanship

[Don't Do it Yourself]

In process of have new bathroom fitted; have a few issues with the quality of workmanship from plumber.

1. SHOWER. I have a 900mm, curved edged shower tray. Plumber has NOT inset tray into the wall nor raised tray from floor. (a) should I insist he does? I\\\'I'm concerned about relying on sealant alone to make shower cubicle watertight (b) waste water from separate bath is refluxing back into shower tray, pipes joined at connector, is this resolved easily?

2. BATH. Removal of old bath left a 3cm gap in wall. Plumber did not plaster over gap. Rim of new bath rests at same height as gap in wall i.e. bath not resting against wall. Should I insist that gap is plastered over to minimise movement when using bath? A frame will be built for panels - will this reduce movement? I\\\'m concerned movement will affect tiling on wall.

 

[kevplumb]

so take it up with the plumber

or are you just looking for ammo to throw at him

 

[ollski]

In process of have new bathroom fitted; have a few issues with the quality of workmanship from plumber.

1. SHOWER. I have a 900mm, curved edged shower tray. Plumber has NOT inset tray into the wall nor raised tray from floor. (a) should I insist he does? I\\\'I'm concerned about relying on sealant alone to make shower cubicle watertight (b) waste water from separate bath is refluxing back into shower tray, pipes joined at connector, is this resolved easily?

2. BATH. Removal of old bath left a 3cm gap in wall. Plumber did not plaster over gap. Rim of new bath rests at same height as gap in wall i.e. bath not resting against wall. Should I insist that gap is plastered over to minimise movement when using bath? A frame will be built for panels - will this reduce movement? I\\\'m concerned movement will affect tiling on wall.

If its work in progress then mention these things to him. Most shower trays are not required to be set into the wall as they come with an upstand to go under the tiles, but there will have been fixing instructions with the tray anyway. Point b is remedied with a non return valve in the waste pipe. Just out of interest if the tray isn't raised how does the trap and waste pipe fit?

The bath should go to the wall (preferably into a chase) where it will be fixed with brackets underneath, levelled on the feet and secured on a wooden frame. Then siliconed to the wall, tiled over the top and the tiles siliconed to the bath edge

 

[Don't Do it Yourself]

Plumber presently on holiday but I will take it up with him when he returns; I'm not happy with the work.

Its not so much 'ammo' but an alternative expert opinion. I think the detail in his work is poor with regards to both issues below. I'd like to be able to back up my position.

Added to below, I also had him plumb-in the washing machine. He attached an 12 inch extension to the waste pipe, fixing this to the waste of the kitchen sink. The angle is such that the washing machine cannot physically pump the water at that angle through such a length of pipe. Consequently I've had to disconnect the extension and hold the waste pipe over a bucket to use the machine.

Venting a bit of frustration here but this is basic stuff for a plumber. Surely this is not a high standard of work???


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ollski wrote:
Don't Do it Yourself wrote:


If its work in progress then mention these things to him. Most shower trays are not required to be set into the wall as they come with an upstand to go under the tiles, but there will have been fixing instructions with the tray anyway. Point b is remedied with a non return valve in the waste pipe. Just out of interest if the tray isn't raised how does the trap and waste pipe fit?

The bath should go to the wall (preferably into a chase) where it will be fixed with brackets underneath, levelled on the feet and secured on a wooden frame. Then siliconed to the wall, tiled over the top and the tiles siliconed to the bath edge



Thanks for your comments.

SHOWER (a) The shower tray sits on the floor; he has taken the trap and waste under the wooden floor boards. To my logic there is no gravity to carry the water away with this setup. I cannot test the flow as shower is not presently fitted. Does this installation seem reasonable? Should I have the tray elevated onto a stand?

SHOWER (b) if by upstand you mean a lip on the edge of the tray, this tray does not have one. It is a smooth-edge quadrant shower tray. While it sits near flush with the wall at the right angle edge, near the edges away from the right angle, where the walls are uneven, there is a centimetre or so, gap between the tray and the wall. This means that I'm only relying on the sealant to keep the shower watertight. In absence of upstand, should tray be chased into wall?

BATH: presently the bath sits only on its four legs which are screwed into two pieces of wood secured to the floor. I will have a frame built for the panels but is this sufficient to keep the bath 'stable'?

Thanks

 

[ChrisR]

You're right that wastes will only work down hill. If a pipe has to go uphill the water will rest at the height of the "out" end so there is a length of pipe where hair and other gunge will settle, and may cause a blockage or slow-running after a while.

The tiles would normally come down on to the horizontal (ish) part of the shower tray. Personally I'd scrape enough from the walls to make that the case if possible, simply because a heck of a lot of sealant would be needed otherwise. But it IS only sealant which seals shower trays and the like. We see a lot where rolled up newspaper fills gaps with the sealant on top. As long as the sealant is between two clean surfaces it works - but these ARE usually the places which end up leaking.

If I have a gap which is unavoidable (tiled wall is concave at side of bath for example) I use a quadrant (quarter round) moulding from a double glazing merchant. Up to about 25mm radius/width, these look pretty neat and there isn't loads of silicone on show.

Washing machine - the pumps on those are usually strong, no problem pumping up and over the edge of a sink, say, so I wonder if there's a blockage.


There are various grades of poor plumber - some are out for the quickest possible job, some just don't know/understand much, some are just a bit thick. Once you know you have one of those, you have to either get rid of him or cajole /encourage him into doing things better!

 

[JPC]

uug....dont gerit...u what

 

[doitall]

uug....dont gerit...u what

what dont you get jpc

Installing curved shower trays will depend on the tiles being used.

For example the "Showerlux" has different instruction, for the english or continental way.

English tile onto the tray, Continentals tile first, the showerlux frame will not fit the tray if you install the tray the english method with thick tiles

 

[JPC]

was trying to be thick..soz (in responce to chris's)

 

[ChrisR]

You mean act so thick they pay you to go away? Nice one- let us know how you get on!

 

[Slugbabydotcom]

Any chance of posting some pics ????

It's hard to tell from here whats going on without them.

Then we can all have a balanced approach to the problems you are having.

Generally speaking its not expected of a plumber to start plastering walls. Personally I enjoy plastering and may be inclined to do it if asked nicely or if I have specifically included it in an estimate.

With regards the shower tray a HepV0 [non return] valve will cure the problem as already suggested.

About the washing machine. Keeping the outlet hose too low can cause the water to run straight out of the machine and it is here where a picture would be most useful. I feel based on some of your comments eg

'I'm concerned about relying on sealant alone to make shower cubicle watertight

that you may have some misconceptions about plumbing and may end up having a big row for no apparent reason