Ssssssshhhhhh, don't mention Reform.

[Deleted member 323070]

Eh? If they can’t leave French waters, they will have to return to or be taken to French shores by the French coastguard.

Currently they don't even bother to take enough fuel, because they know the RNLI taxi service will rescue them.

And they won't make it back to France neither, nor avoid the shipping.
Not forgetting that we need a small army of boats and people willing to endanger life in the channel.

 

[Deleted member 323070]

You are just imagining how it works now.

You want him to imagine how it would work in your fantasy world

Firstly, there are drones, advanced radar and intelligence sources that could easily intercept the boat before it reached UK waters.

A drone can detect, it cannot prevent a boat proceeding n its chosen course.
Before any nearby boat can reach the small boat, they will be in UK waters.

They are also often accompanied by French patrol vessels.

Because the migrants can threaten to endanger the boat and the other occupants if the French intervene.

The number of so called "uncontrolled" landings are tiny.

The number of small boat arrivals are only 10% of the total, but you are totally focused on them.

Correct - they can be intercepted with ease - they don't exactly move very quick.

By the time a nearby vessel has intercepted the small boat, they may well be in UK waters. Unless we deploy about 10 vessels to intercept the small boats, and man them with sufficient trained staff.

and is permitted to land his rescued passengers at the nearest port.

When the nearest port is 6 miles that way, and half a dozen miles this way. Hmmm, difficult decision.

Which is done in coordination with French coastguard. its happened a few times. UK SARs vessels assists French coast guard and delivers "passengers" to France.

In case of severe distress and potential drownings, it's all hands to the pump.

 

[pete01]

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[Deleted member 323070]

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I see your point.

 

[Mottie]

Fine, but not Reform's policy. You said you agreed with them all.

You said "So you disagree with Reform's position of returning them to French shores?". That implies that Reform has a position of returning them to French shores. I agree with that position.

 

[Highway Man]

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Good point Pete.

 

[Deleted member 323070]

Good point Pete.

Black mark for you, I think.

 

[pete01]

Good point Pete.

I posted in the wrong thread....

 

[Deleted member 323070]

I posted in the wrong thread....

Do0n't humiliate DickTurpin, he thinks your mistake in the wrong thread was good.

 

[denso13]

That implies that Reform has a position of returning them to French shores. I agree with that position.

They want to drop them off in France, not allowed without French agreement. Just hollow words for the Faragists.

 

[Highway Man]

Do0n't humiliate DickTurpin, he thinks your mistake in the wrong thread was good.

It was

 

[motorbiking]

You want him to imagine how it would work in your fantasy world


A drone can detect, it cannot prevent a boat proceeding n its chosen course.
Before any nearby boat can reach the small boat, they will be in UK waters.


Because the migrants can threaten to endanger the boat and the other occupants if the French intervene.


The number of small boat arrivals are only 10% of the total, but you are totally focused on them.


By the time a nearby vessel has intercepted the small boat, they may well be in UK waters. Unless we deploy about 10 vessels to intercept the small boats, and man them with sufficient trained staff.


When the nearest port is 6 miles that way, and half a dozen miles this way. Hmmm, difficult decision.


In case of severe distress and potential drownings, it's all hands to the pump.

I’m not sure I’d trust your channel navigation you seem to think France is further away than England, in French waters.

 

[MNW67]

I’m not sure I’d trust your channel navigation you seem to think France is further away than England, in French waters.

Can you talk through how you envisage an encounter taking place. Will the British boats be literally on the border between the two waters. Will they be turned sideways or head on. If the small boat tries to get past them, what will they do.

 

[motorbiking]

Sure, the UK has advanced radar and drone surveillance monitoring the channel. All the normal shipping, fishing and leisure craft are easy to filter, because they (mostly) have something called AIS. This is basically your number plate and your radio broadcasts this constantly with your Lat/long. So you are only looking for small craft heading from France at lowish speeds that do not transmit an AIS. Almost no uncontrolled landings occur, because most of the small boats are tracked and intercepted. So finding them and tracking them is not the problem. It will take them at least 2 hours from departure to reach the limit. It will take an intercept less than 30 minutes to meet them.

Before they get to UK territorial waters, that are intercepted and asked if they are in distress and require assistance. A yes, results in a mayday relay call to French coastguard, who will task the nearest vessel to assist, unless they have SARs vessels in the vicinity. Any vessel tasked to assist a vessel in distress has the right to take them to a French port, which will be the nearest, given they are not yet in UK waters. They do not require the permission of French authorities and cannot themselves be prosecuted for trafficking. SOLAS rules protect them.

Assuming the illegals are wise to this, and say they Do not require assistance (which is usual when in French waters), they are refused entry to UK waters and instructed to turn around. All the time they are not in distress they can be forcibly pushed back at the UK limit

What can't happen is for the UK to just pop them on a boat when picked up in UK waters and take them back to France, without permission. So the way Reform describe it, is a little off, but no doubt there will be smart maritime lawyers helping them, for the appropriate fee.

 

[Highway Man]

Sure, the UK has advanced radar and drone surveillance monitoring the channel. All the normal shipping, fishing and leisure craft are easy to filter, because they (mostly) have something called AIS. This is basically your number plate and your radio broadcasts this constantly with your Lat/long. So you are only looking for small craft heading from France at lowish speeds that do not transmit an AIS. Almost no uncontrolled landings occur, because most of the small boats are tracked and intercepted. So finding them and tracking them is not the problem. It will take them at least 2 hours from departure to reach the limit. It will take an intercept less than 30 minutes to meet them.

Before they get to UK territorial waters, that are intercepted and asked if they are in distress and require assistance. A yes, results in a mayday relay call to French coastguard, who will task the nearest vessel to assist, unless they have SARs vessels in the vicinity. Any vessel tasked to assist a vessel in distress has the right to take them to a French port, which will be the nearest, given they are not yet in UK waters. They do not require the permission of French authorities and cannot themselves be prosecuted for trafficking. SOLAS rules protect them.

Assuming the illegals are wise to this, and say they Do not require assistance (which is usual when in French waters), they are refused entry to UK waters and instructed to turn around. All the time they are not in distress they can be forcibly pushed back at the UK limit

What can't happen is for the UK to just pop them on a boat when picked up in UK waters and take them back to France, without permission. So the way Reform describe it, is a little off, but no doubt there will be smart maritime lawyers helping them, for the appropriate fee.

Good enough for me to know you are the expert on these matters as I suggested. You know more than any of us on such things.