Thermostat questions

[JaffaCakes]

Hi all,

I am living in a property that uses oil fired central heating.

There isn't really any way to set the heating to a greater predefined setting apart from On or Off, Warm or Cold.

The oil system controls both the heating and water - we cannot chose between the two - once we turn on the heat, the water is also heated. Should we wish to get the water warmed up faster we turn all of the radiators off (apart from the ones in the hallway, downstairs and upstairs toilet).

I have had a look at our configuration and it comprises of a simple on off switch (like a lighting switch) that is controlled via a apt Timer that has an off, on, or clock settings.

To override everything and have the system on full blast (say to heat the water) you turn on the switch, and then turn the apt timer to 'on'.

I was wondering are there any products that I could use to replace the apt timer that would enable me to have a thermostat for a greater comfort and potentially fuel savings also? I'm thinking something that I can use to set an overall level of heat in the house, and should I need to have the water heated press an override button or something?

I'm not most clued up about this sort of thing (as I am sure you can tell) therefore my post might seem a little vague.

Please see the below picture to see how I currently control my heating:
View media item 70096

 

[Burnerman]

Thats purely a time clock.....lets know what boiler you have, and there will be a room thermostat to suit it!
My own ancient oil system has a thermostat in the hall that controls the circulating pump - with that off, the boiler heats up the domestic hot water, the temperature of which is controlled by the boilers own 'stat.
John

 

[TCCHeating]

By the sounds of it, you have gravity hot water.




For better control you will need the following installed:

A programmable room thermostat (prob wireless)
A cylinder thermostat
A 2 port valve installed onto the gravity hot water
And a competent electrician to install and wire them all up

This will give you a lot more control over your heating and hot water, without having to convert to a fully pumped system.

 

[JaffaCakes]

I hope these are the pictures you are looking for?

View media item 70097View media item 70098View media item 70099

 

[Boilerman2]

You are alreasy fully pumped - sadly systems installed in Ireland fall well short when it comes to proper control!

 

[JaffaCakes]

You are alreasy fully pumped - sadly systems installed in Ireland fall well short when it comes to proper control!

Therefore there is little to no option for myself to gain greater control over my system?

 

[Boilerman2]

You are clearly not reading your replies
EVERYONE has suggested a ROOM THermostat and CYLINDER Thermostat, this will require the services on a heating engineer - as it is clearly beyond your comprehension

 

[JaffaCakes]

You are clearly not reading your replies
EVERYONE has suggested a ROOM THermostat and CYLINDER Thermostat, this will require the services on a heating engineer - as it is clearly beyond your comprehension

Firstly, quoting your response is quite indicative of me reading the responses here.

When you said that "You are alreasy fully pumped - sadly systems installed in Ireland fall well short when it comes to proper control!" I took this as the fact that due to some reason (outside my understanding) I couldn't do anything further.

Therefore please continue to further alienate me as a forum member who has came here to ask genuine questions. After all this is a forum where such questions are asked.

When you say "Everyone", only one person out of a forum consisting of 192,222 (@22:12, excluding myself) has suggested such products. Therefore I can again quite happily confirm that you are further trying to alienate someone who has less knowledge than yourself about plumbing and heating.

As a closing note to you Boilerman2 you have not once made a suggestion here, and as such unless you have something positive and comprehensive to say, please don't say it at all.


To TCCHeating:
1. Could you confirm a price as to how much I would expect to pay for such an installation?
2. Would I need to ring both a plumber and an electrician, or just an electrician?
3. How much electrical cabling would I expect to be done?

 

[JaffaCakes]

So I phoned around a few heating engineers today. Didn't get too much of a great response however one was saying that because I only have 1 set of flow and return pipes on the boiler there isn't much that I can do. He did however recommend Honeywell's Evohome (working out at £120 per radiator).

I thought it was just as simple as having the above mentioned fitted and that way this will enable me just to bypass the hot water filling the tank should I only want the house heated. Should I want the water heated, this would mean that the house would be heated and the water also heated.

I'm probably not getting this at all.

 

[Madrab]

If you have a 2 pipe system ( 1 flow and 1 return) then it can be converted to take 2/3 port valves and interlocks (controls like thermostats/programmer etc), so the advice that there isn't much you can do is wrong!

If you are fully pumped then you need to look at a Y or S plan system to give you the control you are looking for. Either a 3 port valve allowing CH water to be directed to the cylinder or the rads ( Y plan) or 2 2 port valves that will close either depending on demand or request (S Plan).

To answer your questions -

1. Could you confirm a price as to how much I would expect to pay for such an installation?
A. Really hard to estimate, due to the great variety of plumber/installer/electrician prices they have for certain jobs. Also really hard to estimate without being onsite. Get 3 quotes from each.
2. Would I need to ring both a plumber and an electrician, or just an electrician?
A. If your plumber has his electrical certificate and is a registered contractor (e.g RECI) then he can legally do the electrical work in NI, if not then a separate registered contractor would be required
3. How much electrical cabling would I expect to be done?
A. Depends on what interlock controls are installed and where they are sited. If a hard wired room thermostat, cylinder stat and valve(s) then it's wiring from the stats, the boiler & valve(s) via a suitably placed junction box. Without knowing the floorplan it's impossible to gauge how much wiring.

 

[JaffaCakes]

If you have a 2 pipe system ( 1 flow and 1 return) then it can be converted to take 2/3 port valves and interlocks (controls like thermostats/programmer etc), so the advice that there isn't much you can do is wrong!

If you are fully pumped then you need to look at a Y or S plan system to give you the control you are looking for. Either a 3 port valve allowing CH water to be directed to the cylinder or the rads ( Y plan) or 2 2 port valves that will close either depending on demand or request (S Plan).

I understand that not being on site is hard to make a proper judgement. I can provide floor plans with the little knowledge of the pipe work in the house.

I think the biggest question for me is the existing installation that I have currently would there be any major modification - i.e. walls being drilled into to run new pipes etc? Or is it a case of installing the 2 port valves on the existing pipe work to meet the desired need?

From assumption I think that a Y plan would need new pipes ran, and an S plan would not?

I can post plenty more pictures should any request them of the plumbing set up (from what I can visually see of course).

 

[Hugh Jaleak]

Basically to install either Y or S plan isn't drastically different. Flow leaves boiler, (vent and cold feed are next on an open vented system), then goes to pump. From pump flow is then split to CH and HW. This can be done either using a 3 port valve (Y plan) which tees the flow off to rads and cylinder, or with a S plan system, flow is teed off using pipework, then a pair of valves are used, one on CH flow, the other on HW flow.

A room thermostat and a cylinder thermostat are fitted. (TRV needs to be removed from rad in room contained roomstat). Should either stat sense call for heat during timed 'on' periods for system, it opens valve as appropriate to that circuit (or both if required) and fire boiler/runs pump. Thus flow from boiler is put where required until appropriate stat is satisfied when it then closes appropriate valve and shuts down boiler/pump.

Depending on current setup, it may just be a case of grafting a valve (or valves) into appropriate pipework, fitting stats as required and connecting it all up electrically.