UK has no alternative to interest rate rises - Hunt

[SirGalahad]

Interesting you mention Truss, one of the reasons cited for her removal was her policies were going to bankrupt the country because they caused the cost of Govt borrowing to spike by increasing the interest rates on bonds/gilts.

As of this week the interest rate on those bonds is higher than after Truss's mini budget.

Truss plans were £45bn of unfunded tax cuts.

Rates spiked and it caused an existential problem for the Pension Industry - it was pure ideological idiocy but that's part of being a Tory - faith over facts.

How the markets broke ‘Trussonomics’

A visual journey through the collapse of Liz Truss’s ill-fated economic project

www.ft.com

Oh no the left wing FT.

 

[SirGalahad]

It's the same tired bs - tax cuts and deregulation will transform the economy they have presided over.
It's never their fault always outside forces stopping them and the dogs like Mottie, Filly etc bark their approval.

I cannot describe your faith other than in terms of a loyal pet and what's more loyal than a dog?

 

[ellal]

So they came for you first - no wonder you're so bitter!

Methinks it's the old out of breath scaffold pole wielding thug that is bitter...

Some of us who have made enough to enjoy life (without resorting to violence) also care about the way society is heading...

Because as that society falls further and further down the sh*thole, then all will suffer...

No amount of scaffold poles will save you then

 

[ReganAndCarter]

In the Tesco near me, petrol is 142.9 and diesel is 141.9. Haven’t seen diesel cheaper than petrol for ages.

About time us oil burners got a break.

 

[festive]

It;s great you believe in trickle down economics based on supply side economics and the debunked laffer curve.

We saw some under Truss - look what happened.

Might as well believe in fairies.

We saw nothing under Truss, none of her policies were given a chance, why? Remove your political Brown Star Starmer underpants and just take an unbiased view on how we should run our country, its not Tory i agree not is it current Labour i believe. Re Truss, we saw someone taking the initiative over the markets, they the markets only like a puppet government out she went.

This Government will scarper off into history, financially secure for the rest of their days on this planet! The rest of us will be picking up their financial incompetence for the rest of our lives! Never has such an incapable bunch of charlatans been able to get their hands on "power" mainly by the support and manipulation of a media system that is as corrosive as they are. And the only thing we have opposing them is 'the opposition party' opposing sh't for the sake of opposing and gaining votes. It's all a sh't show.

 

[cwhaley]

Some people are in for a shock though - we're going to see who the genuinely wealthy are, and who is posing about on borrowed money. When the tide goes out, you get to see who's swimming naked.

The shock is going to hit millions unfairly.

Aside from a mortgage, we have little financial debt because we are prudent and spend and save sensibly. Interest rates "getting back to normal" (when rates were much higher and house prices much lower!) will - quite simply - take us to the edge of poverty.

Currently we have a comfortable disposable income which allows us to save and have the odd treat. Expected interest rate hikes will take all of that away and will will suffer. There's no other way I can look at it.

I don't trust a word this government has to say about the economy, either. I distinctly remember George Osborne telling us he'd eliminate the national debt by 2015...

 

[fillyboy]

And the only thing we have opposing them is 'the opposition party' opposing sh't for the sake of opposing and gaining votes. It's all a sh't show.

That's one of the great things about Boris. He is the opposition, without actually being in the opposition.
That's why he had to go, it was never about a glass of wine and a slice of birthday cake.

 

[SirGalahad]

We saw nothing under Truss, none of her policies were given a chance, why? Remove your political Brown Star Starmer underpants and just take an unbiased view on how we should run our country, its not Tory i agree not is it current Labour i believe. Re Truss, we saw someone taking the initiative over the markets, they the markets only like a puppet government out she went.

This Government will scarper off into history, financially secure for the rest of their days on this planet! The rest of us will be picking up their financial incompetence for the rest of our lives! Never has such an incapable bunch of charlatans been able to get their hands on "power" mainly by the support and manipulation of a media system that is as corrosive as they are. And the only thing we have opposing them is 'the opposition party' opposing sh't for the sake of opposing and gaining votes. It's all a sh't show.

They were given a chance - they were unfunded - what more do you need to know.

How did her policies address the systemic weakness in the UK economy of low growth and an aging population by cutting taxes?

The markets react, now there is a separate point are the markets always rational - in this case what would you expect bond holders and investors to do?

So tell me - what policies do you want.

What we agree I believe is that the current economic policies and system cannot continue - this ever mounting debt.

 

[SirGalahad]

That's one of the great things about Boris. He is the opposition, without actually being in the opposition.
That's why he had to go, it was never about a glass of wine and a slice of birthday cake.

Stop sniffing boris bumhole its toxic. He was in power ergo not in the opposition - this is like the Trump fans - the guy in power is never in power, so he can excuse away his mistakes.

 

[Mottie]

Methinks it's the old out of breath scaffold pole wielding thug that is bitter...

Yeah, if only I was armed with a tongue as sharp as yours - I’d certainly give those cheeky ruffians a piece of my mind and no mistake. They wouldn't dare come back for another ear bashing.

Say, you weren’t going to give me one of your famous severe ear bashings when you offered to meet up with me that time when you said I’d "pîss my pants" when we met, were you? If so and the offers still open, I’d better get my ear defenders on. BTW I’m still waiting for you to get back to me with the location of the meet and also telling me how I will identify you when I see you.

 

[motorbiking]

I don't think the energy subsidy was particularly well managed.
Allowing Energy firms to increase prices and then give a credit to the consumer, artificially fuels inflation.
Had the subsidy been applied to wholesale prices and the caps maintained, we would probably have had lower inflation.

 

[festive]

They were given a chance - they were unfunded - what more do you need to know.

How did her policies address the systemic weakness in the UK economy of low growth and an aging population by cutting taxes?

The markets react, now there is a separate point are the markets always rational - in this case what would you expect bond holders and investors to do?

So tell me - what policies do you want.

What we agree I believe is that the current economic policies and system cannot continue - this ever mounting debt.

What policies do i want? I want back what Truss wanted to implement i honestly believed this was good for us. You ask how this would stimulate low growth:

Stimulating Economic Growth: By cutting taxes, a government can increase the amount of money that households and businesses have at their disposal. Businesses can then use these extra funds to invest in research and development, expanding operations, or hiring new employees, which can spur economic growth. Households may increase their consumption, which boosts demand, driving further economic growth. Lower corporate taxes can also attract foreign direct investment, which can additionally stimulate growth.

Truss had also mentioned keeping Corp Tax low which again addresses the above to attract foreign investment. I can't help but feel the markets don't want UK to prosper they have already hedged their bets on other markets EU perhaps so they don't want us to succeed.

 

[SirGalahad]

What policies do i want? I want back what Truss wanted to implement i honestly believed this was good for us. You ask how this would stimulate low growth:

Stimulating Economic Growth: By cutting taxes, a government can increase the amount of money that households and businesses have at their disposal. Businesses can then use these extra funds to invest in research and development, expanding operations, or hiring new employees, which can spur economic growth. Households may increase their consumption, which boosts demand, driving further economic growth. Lower corporate taxes can also attract foreign direct investment, which can additionally stimulate growth.

Truss had also mentioned keeping Corp Tax low which again addresses the above to attract foreign investment. I can't help but feel the markets don't want UK to prosper they have already hedged their bets on other markets EU perhaps so they don't want us to succeed.

Well if you honestly believe that then I cannot argue against faith, but can against doctrine and facts.

Truss budget was more trickle down economics which there is scant evidence that it works. But it's a simple idea thats easy to sell. It's based on the now discredited work of Arthur Laffer and his Laffer curve.

Trickle-down economics are a cruel hoax. Invest in infrastructure, education and public health

Politicians rarely want to raise taxes on the rich. Joe Biden promised to do so but a closely divided Congress is already balking. That’s because they’ve bought into one of the most dangerous of all economic ideas: that economic growth requires the rich to become even richer. Rubbish.

blogs.berkeley.edu

When you cut taxes - the Government has a shortfall - how does it cover that? Ergo the markets reactions to Truss unfunded tax cuts.

Tax cuts for the wealthy only benefit the rich | LSE Research

History suggests that policies relying on “trickle-down economics” are destined to fail, and yet the idea, for some, still persists. David Hope explains why tax cuts for top earners only benefit the rich and why the issue is so controversial to discuss.

www.lse.ac.uk

The idea of trickle down economics is like the idea of Brexit - they need us more than we need them - so the corner shop needs you more than you need it is the level of analysis.

Truss policies were idiotic and if you cannot see that then really what hope is there.

 

[Ivor Windybottom]

The Truss policies may or may not have been idiotic, but they definitely weren't a big deal. It was just a small shift from what went before, and the budget wasn't huge in comparison to the endless sinking into debt that was (and is) already happening.

What it did show is just how close to oblivion we really are, just a minor deviation was enough to cause chaos. Exactly the same will happen if Sunak or Starmer try to change too much at once. The UK is now a slave to the markets, we're powerless.

So back on topic, interest rates will rise further and will stay high long into the future. The previous fifteen years were the blip, not the present. Those who can't afford their mortgage need to confront reality and make some brave decisions - selling voluntarily may be better than reposession and/or bankruptcy. The government simply can't afford to bail anyone out this time, we blew the last of the money anyone was going to lend us on the plandemic.

 

[nwgs]

plandemic

You can’t say that in here! Even if it is true.