vorkera flowmatic 20 - 80 RS problem.

[nickso]

i would repair it but then i like this boiler and tonybhoy and agile clearly do not. too many far fetched reasons for not repairing and a few good ones for repairing it.

a service, new prv, and an external expansion vessel with a cap on the old one to isolate it isnt going to cost the earth, the fan and venturi should be cleaned as part of the service. the labour charges for all of this are for you to find out and weigh up, do not let the fantasies of some of the dreamers on here sway you towards a new boiler simply because they dont like it or know nothing about it. as someone has already mentioned if the £850 quote is to simply whack a new boiler on the wall then IMO its a waste of money leading to an even bigger waste of money when it all goes wrong.

IMO dont install a new worcester, anyone worth their salt can see the recent decline of their products quality and design. i dont see enough new vaillants to comment but i wouldnt have touched any of their older stuff with an insulated pole. i have a new vokera linea HE in my house but as its only 6 months old its hard to tell if its as good as their older stuff. looking at it when i installed it it certainly seems to be good.

 

[gas4you]

Is that one of the new ones with the sideways HE nick? If so how do you get on with servicing etc?

Thought they looked a right pig of a design to work on at installer live and could only wonder if the designer was on speed when he thought it up

 

[nickso]

Is that one of the new ones with the sideways HE nick? If so how do you get on with servicing etc?

Thought they looked a right pig of a design to work on at installer live and could only wonder if the designer was on speed when he thought it up

well this is the thing dave, ive not serviced one yet hence my comments above.

i had a look at it when i hung it on the wall and the hydraulic bits look as easy as the old linea to remove, a few more complications but nothing major.

the stuff in the combustion chamber doesnt look that bad either and the only thing i was remotely worried about was the length of the burner as it could be a pig to remove if its hard up to a wall, mine is so ill be finding out in june

 

[gas4you]

Vokera chap told us that you only need 12mm side clearance to remove the burner etc. Couldn't see it myself. Good luck.

Still you're better than me, haven't serviced my crappy Suprima for 3 years now

Every time I say to missus that I'll service it she says I cant as she has just cleaned and tidied the Kitchen

 

[nickso]

Vokera chap told us that you only need 12mm side clearance to remove the burner etc. Couldn't see it myself. Good luck.

Still you're better than me, haven't serviced my rubbishy Suprima for 3 years now

Every time I say to missus that I'll service it she says I cant as she has just cleaned and tidied the Kitchen

meh, what servicing does a suprima need? apart from the pcb they are bulletproof, if i had one i wouldnt bother opening it up either.

any condensing boiler needs at the very least a cursory glance at the condensate trap.

 

[delta191]

wow - thanks for all the knowledge and pointers! what a wise bunch

it's a split decision, roughly half say repair the flowmatic, half say ditch it and get a new one.
I feel alot happier about getting another vokera combi after reading your views. just goes to show - dont always listen to your friends advice! and I now know 850.00 quid is a decent quote.

I think tonybhoy's advice is the one to go for:-

Spending £120 on an old boiler is a complete waste of money!

You know as well as I do-least you should-just how old those boilers are and as sure as eggs are eggs some other major component will go in the not to distant future.

A fan for those boilers is near the £100 mark ex fitting as is the board.

Boilers are too cheap nowadays ,relatively speaking.

Expensive repairs to old ones is just not cost effective.

Anyway you just need to touch something on a boiler of that age and it is leak city.

The vent plug above the domestic heat ex will probably be all chewed up meaning you can't vent it once it has been drained down which means no hot water which means another part replace and on it goes.

I think that kind of sums it all up really!

thanks for all the help fella's

 

[nickso]

riiiight.

well i tried lol.

it seems tonybhoy's assumptions win the day

 

[sooey]

850 quid supply and fit, he must be tying it to the wall with string, and piping up with garden hose. Still it should keep you going for at least a year or two.

 

[tonybhoy]

850 quid supply and fit, he must be tying it to the wall with string, and piping up with garden hose. Still it should keep you going for at least a year or two.

Guy's doing the job for next to nothing if truth be told and that was basically my point,changing is really a no brainer.

Vokeras come with a two year warranty so that price is effectively really only £770 because Vokera charge £85 for an extended warranty on 'their' Sabre boilers.

So if the OP goes for a Sabre he should be able to get that price above with only the one year warranty for the exact same (almost) Vokera Compact.

 

[sooey]

My point was if he's doing it for next to nothing what kind of a job is he gonna do, and how long is it going to last etc.etc.

 

[tonybhoy]

My point was if he's doing it for next to nothing what kind of a job is he gonna do, and how long is it going to last etc.etc.

I agree with you but the price is very tempting from a customer's point of view.

I mean how bad can he make it.

Changing a Vokera for another Vokera isn't that difficult and at worst your talking about £50 for materials including Inhib and cleaner.

All depends on which boiler though.Be interested to find out.

You can get a Sabre 24 SE for about £360 and a compact 24 SE for £409 I think and that includes filling loop flue and Vok mech clock.

The original boiler is certainly a SE boiler.

 

[delta191]

he did say he would have to do something with the pipes, said the pipes have to be made up to 22mm, someone has put 15mm pipes in, he said they should have been 22mm for the the first meter leading from the flowmatic 20 - 80.

he said it total more than 850.00 with some extra pipework.

he also looked outside at the outlet (where steam appears) shown me the steal tube had gone, he pushed his finger up through the gap in the pipe to show me where it had gone! I wasn't even aware of this.

I'll keep you posted with model of vokera he has in mind, said it would have a 2 year warranty. I got the distinct impression he has some perk from selling a vokera, which is fair enough.

 

[tonybhoy]

he did say he would have to do something with the pipes, said the pipes have to be made up to 22mm, someone has put 15mm pipes in, he said they should have been 22mm for the the first meter leading from the flowmatic 20 - 80.

he said it total more than 850.00 with some extra pipework.

he also looked outside at the outlet (where steam appears) shown me the steal tube had gone, he pushed his finger up through the gap in the pipe to show me where it had gone! I wasn't even aware of this.

I'll keep you posted with model of vokera he has in mind, said it would have a 2 year warranty. I got the distinct impression he has some perk from selling a vokera, which is fair enough.

Gotta be stealing the boiler mate.

He is going to fit a Compact HE cause that is the cheapest boiler range Vokera do aside from the Sabre range about which 'they no notheen'.

Sorry a wee joke.Vokera don't make the Sabre-nudge nudge wink wink.

Anyway,Sabre only comes with a one year warranty all other Vokera Vokeras come with a two year warranty so its got to be a compact and HE because your in England unless it is impossible to fit an HE.

Do you have a waste pipe close to the boiler?

Flue pipe on an HE boiler is completely different from the flue pipe on a SE so yer man will have to change the flue pipe anyway (the pipe that has the hole in it)in any event the gas regs say you have to change a flue-pipe when you change a boiler even it your changing the same make of boiler.

Plus the alterations to the F&R pipework at the boiler all adds up to a knicked boiler,IMO.

Any idea what size your gas supply to the boiler is?If it's 15MM then it will have to be re-piped in 22MM copper.

Best of luck.

 

[delta191]

Do you really think it's a knock off then? or are joking? what does the IMO mean?

he asked to look at the gas pipe feeding the gas cooker, just checked it myself, its 15mm I'd say. he said the boiler is fed from the cooker pipe and asked if when the boiler and cooker are on at the same time, do i notice any fluctation in the boiler or cooker flames?

He also asked to see the pipe from the gas meter but its a niightmare to reach, so I said only if you want to move a cabinet with 300 dvd's on! lol.
so we never looked.

Do you have a waste pipe close to the boiler? yes - infact the overflow from the boiler leads directly into the sink drain pipe and outside into the grid. he has pointed this out that whoever did this was daft. the overflow should be piped straight through the wall and would have to been done with the new boiler.

 

[tonybhoy]

Do you really think it's a knock off then? or are joking? what does the IMO mean?

he asked to look at the gas pipe feeding the gas cooker, just checked it myself, its 15mm I'd say. he said the boiler is fed from the cooker pipe and asked if when the boiler and cooker are on at the same time, do i notice any fluctation in the boiler or cooker flames?

He also asked to see the pipe from the gas meter but its a niightmare to reach, so I said only if you want to move a cabinet with 300 dvd's on! lol.
so we never looked.

Do you have a waste pipe close to the boiler? yes - infact the overflow from the boiler leads directly into the sink drain pipe and outside into the grid. he has pointed this out that whoever did this was daft. the overflow should be piped straight through the wall and would have to been done with the new boiler.

Looks like it to me.

Those boiler prices I quoted are the cheapest Vokera prices that I know of,obviously if you buy volume you'll get them cheaper but by much I don't have a clue,so yer man is either buying in volume or he is buying from out of the back door of a supplier.

Even supposing he is fitting the cheapest HE Vokera Compact at £469 including flue and clock he has still got to spend at about another £40 to get it on the wall so he is doing the job for no more that £350 if that.

The overflow your talking about,I think is the safety pipe.I'm talking about the condensate waste for the boiler if he is fitting an HE boiler (condenser) which he must fit becuase you have a waste pipe nearby.

Sounds as though your gas supply to the boiler is insufficient which will affect your hot water.If he is only going to fit a 24KW boiler to your existing gas supply then ,basically your hot water will be poor.

If he is going to upgrade your gas supply to 22MM then you really need to think about going for the 29KW or even the 35KW Compact .The difference in price is about £120 and £60 respectively.

If he can't or won't up-grade the gas supply then re-consider.Either get someone who will or repair the existing boiler because you won't really be any better off ,certainly in terms of hot water and there is no point in fitting any of the larger boilers for the same reason.