what boiler?

[transam]

Not everything Johnson & Starley manufacture is British - State Water Heaters for a start made in the U.S of A I doubt that the "British made boiler contains very many "British components" - Honeywell Combustion parts - Dutch, Sit gas controls Italy etc etc

Quite so , I doubt wether it would be possible to build an all british component boiler , car or anything else , in-fact the word boiler manu' is probably some what mis-leading , boiler assembler's might be a more accurate description ??? but assembled in the u.k will do , I beleive J&S are Canadian owned ??? hence the North American water heater's ???

 

[JPC]

i would always try and sell folk a w/b..easy to install...and if ur bothered, they are made in worcester.

not had any issues with them

 

[transam]

i would always try and sell folk a w/b..easy to install...and if ur bothered, they are made in worcester.

not had any issues with them

Not a fan of alloy heat exc's , that is why I do not use them !!!

 

[joesoap1]

i would always try and sell folk a w/b..easy to install...and if ur bothered, they are made in worcester.

not had any issues with them

Not a fan of alloy heat exc's , that is why I do not use them !!!

What do you recommmend if not Worcester, with stainless HE.As it,s the most important component and most expensive to replace, is it cost efective to opt for the difference?Where does one stop, they all reckon to be the Bees knees.It,s not until you have one, or like yourselves, work on them ,that the problems and quality shows.Hopefully this will be my last one, 65 oap, so I hope.This one still is ok, Vokera flowmatic 80-20, but its needind minor things doing to it, but so does the bmw, every mot. digressing slightly if ok? How often does one do a full MI service? It,s cleaned every year.which seems all the major companies do any way..

 

[JPC]

yes, but they give a 10 yr guarantee on primary hex..sounds good to me

 

[DP]

When the boiler is not in use, does the case get quite hot? Is the pilot going out after prolonged period of non use?

How long does the annual service take?

See plenty of parts have been replaced. Was the replacement for different faults or in order to find and fix one fault?

Pilot outage is not a problem common to Flowmatic- it becomes one if the boiler has not been serviced properly.

 

[Alfredo]

my advice to u O.P . is do not use any boiler that has a ally heat exc' , which would include Ideal & Worcestor !

Normally i'd agree, but it depends on the water type. If you have soft water ally is fine. How do I know...well about ten feet from me is my Ideal (yes I know!!) Turbo 2 18kw with an alloy heat exchanger, installed in 1993. Total repairs since then...1x fan, 1 x condensate syphon (its a thin alloy tube) and a case seal. 17 years and going strong. One wag did observe that "I must have got the one that worked".....

I'd avoid Ideal these days sadly. The one combi I quite like with an Ally H/E is the Glow Worm flexicom for those averse to multi menus on the 'user interface' and too many flashing lights.

Alfredo

 

[transam]

Ally heat exc's , it is flue gas condensate corrosion that concern's me , if you take an extreme example go into my profile & you will see what can happen , this is an extreme example , the boiler in question was condensing 18 hour's a day 7 day's a week , in a domestic situation your boiler would not be working to this extreme ??? when I say condensing , I mean condensing the boiler's never came out of this mode !!!
We approached worsestor a few years ago about installing one of there boiler's in the above situation they stated that the 10 year warranty would be null & void , make of that what u will ????

10 year warranty on heat exc are not new , I believe keston offered this on the thermomatic 15 year's ago , are these long warranty's worth the paper they are written on ??? I have my doubt's , Alpha , Sime all offer 10 year warranty's on there boiler's !!! some cylinder manu's who make stainlees steel cylinder's offer 25 year guarantee's , which either is not worth the paper it is written on ? or they have alot of faith in stainless steel ????? The m.d of Viessman stainless steel advocate's , stated to me that they have never had a heat exc failure due to flue gas condensate corrosion !!!

 

[Alfredo]

I'm sure there are situations where aggressive corrosion could be a problem, but if it were a killer problem they'd have stopped using Alloy long ago.

This one has been used fairly intensively, and if it failed tomorrow I couldn't really complain. We moved away for 13 years and rented the house out, firstly to a US family who kept the house at stratospheric temperatures for two years..seriously..they liked it at a constant 28C. We moved back in four months ago.

This is very much an early phase condensing boiler, and rather than a plastic condensate bottle trap, this one uses a stainless steel sump with a small alloy siphon in 8mm alloy tube which is permanetly exposed to acidic condensate. Well I'm only on my second tube in 17 years as the swan neck corroded away. In fact its time I checked it again really.

I can only really say as I find, and it hasn't been a problem.

Alfredo

 

[joesoap1]

When the boiler is not in use, does the case get quite hot? Is the pilot going out after prolonged period of non use?

How long does the annual service take?

See plenty of parts have been replaced. Was the replacement for different faults or in order to find and fix one fault?

Pilot outage is not a problem common to Flowmatic- it becomes one if the boiler has not been serviced properly.

The caes dose not get hot when idle.Most parts were replaced for 1 fault,homeserve couldn,t find fault, so replaced 1.pressure switch, then ventura, then fan, then pcboard. without heat/water 2 weeks.since then they cannot find why pilot goes out intermitently, works ok for weeks, then just goes out. relights straight away then ok.appox 20 mins service annual, only hoovers out and off basically.homesreve wouldn,t come out few weeks back, fan not running when idle, said it wasn,t covered,andwas ok. I fixed it myself with advice from here, flow swich sticking,pilot light gasses making chamber hot.wasn,t happy chappy.5 years with them no more.otherwise ok at present.

 

[transam]

I'm sure there are situations where aggressive corrosion could be a problem, but if it were a killer problem they'd have stopped using Alloy long ago.

This one has been used fairly intensively, and if it failed tomorrow I couldn't really complain. We moved away for 13 years and rented the house out, firstly to a US family who kept the house at stratospheric temperatures for two years..seriously..they liked it at a constant 28C. We moved back in four months ago.

This is very much an early phase condensing boiler, and rather than a plastic condensate bottle trap, this one uses a stainless steel sump with a small alloy siphon in 8mm alloy tube which is permanetly exposed to acidic condensate. Well I'm only on my second tube in 17 years as the swan neck corroded away. In fact its time I checked it again really.

I can only really say as I find, and it hasn't been a problem.

Alfredo

There was one chap on here , that only recently had a trisave , condenser renewed that was installed in 1980 something !! i would not have to much faith in boiler manu's , many of them know full well that they have problem's with certain component's , & continue to denie it & still sell them to joe public !!!! the heat exchanger I refer to was 18 month's old , I donated another to a training centre !! as u say condenser's have only been fitted enmasse in the U'K since 2005 , early day's , time will tell ,
Joe public will pay a heavy price for this technology ( maybe) ??? & I have faith , that some boiler manu's will weasle there way out of any obligation's , with ref to these 5 /10 year warranty's , that they are offering , in particular if & when alot of claim's start ??? some suggest that it has already started with one manu !!!! with a 5 year warranty ???

 

[joesoap1]

I'm sure there are situations where aggressive corrosion could be a problem, but if it were a killer problem they'd have stopped using Alloy long ago.

This one has been used fairly intensively, and if it failed tomorrow I couldn't really complain. We moved away for 13 years and rented the house out, firstly to a US family who kept the house at stratospheric temperatures for two years..seriously..they liked it at a constant 28C. We moved back in four months ago.

This is very much an early phase condensing boiler, and rather than a plastic condensate bottle trap, this one uses a stainless steel sump with a small alloy siphon in 8mm alloy tube which is permanetly exposed to acidic condensate. Well I'm only on my second tube in 17 years as the swan neck corroded away. In fact its time I checked it again really.

I can only really say as I find, and it hasn't been a problem.

Alfredo

There was one chap on here , that only recently had a trisave , condenser renewed that was installed in 1980 something !! i would not have to much faith in boiler manu's , many of them know full well that they have problem's with certain component's , & continue to denie it & still sell them to joe public !!!! the heat exchanger I refer to was 18 month's old , I donated another to a training centre !! as u say condenser's have only been fitted enmasse in the U'K since 2005 , early day's , time will tell ,
Joe public will pay a heavy price for this technology ( maybe) ??? & I have faith , that some boiler manu's will weasle there way out of any obligation's , with ref to these 5 /10 year warranty's , that they are offering , in particular if & when alot of claim's start ??? some suggest that it has already started with one manu !!!! with a 5 year warranty ???

How long should a HE reasonably last, mine,s 15+ years yet Gov say change 10 year old boilers, scrappage scheme, same with cars, 10 years, you cannot recoup your outlay in savings in that time, from g to a. You need to save £200 per annum for 10 years just to recoup £2000 for reasonable boiler change, then it,s time to do it again.Going green is only to benefit the Gov and industry. " Greenbacks"profit.If global warming was on the cards , We wouldn,t need our boilers, just a kettle

 

[Biguns]

My boiler, a Myson Apollo 30/50B (stainless steel HE) is 22 years old, fitted in the house from new. In the 18 years I have lived here it has cost me £30 in repairs. 1 thermo couple and 1 pump overrun stat. Also contrary to popular myth (put about by people or businesses with a commercial interest)parts are still readily available.
I think it is reasonable to assume that in that time, I could have been on to my second, possibly third codensing boiler,( at a minimum outlay of £6000 against a maximum saving on gas of £1800) and have spent a small fortune on repairs on these very sophisticated pieces of kit.
My boiler shows no sign of giving up, and the maths dictate to me that I should not consider changing it.

 

[joesoap1]

My boiler, a Myson Apollo 30/50B (stainless steel HE) is 22 years old, fitted in the house from new. In the 18 years I have lived here it has cost me £30 in repairs. 1 thermo couple and 1 pump overrun stat. Also contrary to popular myth (put about by people or businesses with a commercial interest)parts are still readily available.
I think it is reasonable to assume that in that time, I could have been on to my second, possibly third codensing boiler,( at a minimum outlay of £6000 against a maximum saving on gas of £1800) and have spent a small fortune on repairs on these very sophisticated pieces of kit.
My boiler shows no sign of giving up, and the maths dictate to me that I should not consider changing it.

Hi, Thanks, as the first reply I had, suggesting I keep my Vokera serviced,parts always available,keep it, don,t change.Only time probably if HE goes. You have been lucky on replacing parts.I,m not bothered about efficiency so much as reliability.Things are too technical now, more to go wrong, with inbuilt faults.Only made to last so long, like TVs, chocolate box resistors, not meant to last.I think I will keep it until it drops or becomes unviable to repair.

 

[Alfredo]

My boiler, a Myson Apollo 30/50B (stainless steel HE) ,( at a minimum outlay of £6000 against a maximum saving on gas of £1800) and have spent a small fortune on repairs on these very sophisticated pieces of kit.

Outlay of £6k min for new boiler? You have expensive tastes. You can pay me 5k to install one anyday as a decent boiler is about 1k these days

Like most boilers, if a reasonable quality condenser is properly installed and maintained it will be mostly trouble free and should do minimum 10 years, and probably nearer 20. The odd one is a pig in a poke, but twas ever thus.

Our Ideal Turbo 2 virtually halved the gas consumption of the Hattersley Vulcan it replaced. Over 17 years I reckon we are ahead.

Alfredo