What bulbs will work with programmable switch?

[abenn]

I've had a programmable electronic switch on one of my lights for several years now, like this one. For a few years now it has worked with the modern energy-saving "folded tube" fluorescent bulbs, but today the bulb blew, and when I replaced it with a new Philips 18W (85W equivalent) "Genie" bulb the bulb flickered when the switch was off, but worked okay when it was on.

I've read about this being a problem when reading reviews of different programmable switches, so it seems I was lucky with the original GE 15W bulb that's just blown.

I've temporarily put in an old fashioned incandescent bulb, a few of which I keep in stock to use with my dimmer switch. But I'd like to replace it with another energy-saving one. Is there a particular type -- LED perhaps -- that's compatible with these electronic switches, please?

 

[Echo the husky]

You need to fit this device as explained in the user manual.

 

[AndyPRK]

Wonder if it works with the digital version of the timer ?

I guess it's just a resistor ?

 

[Echo the husky]

It could well work.

I would expect it to be a capacitor. (In an expensive package with insulated wires.)

CP Electronics tell you in their manuals for their 2 wire electronic switches to connect a capacitor to the circuit between SL and N. The capacitor rating is 1uF for each fitting connected to the switch, up to a certain maximum value. May be 7uF max I forget.

 

[abenn]

Thanks freddo. I'll have to check out my switch more closely, for there's no external markings on it so I don't know if it's exactly the one I gave in my link, it just looks the same.

My particular switch pre-dates energy-saving bulbs but, looking at the ad for the ZV210 today I see that they still say you need to add the FLA01 adapter -- why is it not built in when filament lamps are theoretically no longer available?

But, back to my original question -- would other modern non-fluorescent lamps, such as led, have the same problem?

 

[AndyPRK]

I suspect LED lamps will have the same problem.

You would be better off buying random CFL bulbs and trying them. The higher the wattage the better.

 

[ericmark]

It is down to bulb design. In industry we have a standard 5 ~ 20 mA control where the first 5 mA does nothing. Some bulbs have a similar set-up where the first so many mA will not light the bulb. What happens with the fluorescent bulb is the small current passed through the switch to operate the switch slowly charges a capacitor until there is enough voltage to start the bulb and then the bulb tries to light, however as soon as it tried to fire the voltage drops so all you get is a flash. The LED bulb works slightly different it does not need to start so often you find they are on very dim.

The electronics in the bulb vary so with one 10W bulb it can work A1 and with another it can flash or come on dimmed. Be it a capacitor or resistor across the output they will turn the current leaking through the switch into heat and reduce the voltage to a level where nothing is seen. However clearly even if only a few milliamp you are throwing away power, which when you change bulb could be doubled up on as already built into bulb.

I will guess an LED will be better than CFL as a very dim light is just not noticed but a flash is. What I do is swap bulbs around. Same problem exists with two way lamps and dimming switches. The manufacturers it seems are obliged to mark bulbs if they are non dimmable (I would have expected the reverse) so the chances are bulbs which are dimmable will work OK as the dimmer switch also leaks power. So I would get a dimmable LED bulb and try that. Please tell us if it worked.

 

[abenn]

Ahhh, that explains why my old bulb worked okay for several years. The original was a GE 15-watt one, compared with the Philips 18-watt that I just put in. So maybe I'll just try a couple of different brands of CFL and see if any works -- they'll always be good as spares for the rest of the house. I'll also look out for a dimmable LED bulb but, if I remember correctly from previous shopping, they cost an arm and a leg.

 

[ericmark]

I got a LED 10W BA22d bulb from Aldi which was dimmable, from B&M bargains I got two LED 10W bulbs BA22d non-dimmable for under £10 the pair. At those prices worth a go.

 

[abenn]

10W is a bit too dim, unless their incandescent equivalent is different from the fluorescent bulbs. I need something around the 15/18 watt range (65/85 equivalent, I believe). Anyway, I'm going to have a look around the shops this morning to see what I can get.

 

[abenn]

Well, this is becoming a saga! I've found a few dimmable bulbs, and bought a 9W (allegedly 60W equivalent, so it must be more efficient than the fluorescent ones) LED one at my local Sainsburys, but it's got an Edison screw end. I've tried by local DIY stores (Wickes and B&Q), but they don't stock Edison screw bulb holders, despite stocking about equal quantities of bayonet and screw-ended bulbs. I've checked out a couple of "bargain" stores, but all they have is incandescent filament bulbs, but still no bulb holders.

What's puzzling me is, why so many screw-ended bulbs are on sale, but no holders for them? Are new British houses using screw sockets instead of bayonet? I see I can get Edison bulb holders on the internet, but they're all "antique" style brass ones. Why no regular white bakelite ones from mainstream suppliers?

 

[AndyPRK]

Some light fittings do use screw bulbs. But not ones which hang from a cable.

 

[abenn]

eBay came to my rescue with a screw bulb holder for my pendant light, but the dimmable led 9W (60W equivalent) bulb I got from Sainsbury's for £4.50 is acting strange. It switched on/off okay when I first installed it, then next time I switched on/off it just went dim when I switched off. An hour or so later I then switched on and off again, and it lit and then switched off correctly. I'm going to put the incandescent bulb back in tomorrow, then it looks like the capacitor (or whatever it is, as mentioned by freddo in an earlier post) is the only way I'll get a reliable system with modern low-energy bulbs.