Why can't my new Bosch (2.35kW) oven plug into ring main?

[Pembo]

Bit of red bit of blue -sitting on the fence then!!

You seem to have made you mind up mate so carry on.

The blue was not my text - it was an extract from one of the posted replies, I hadn't worked out how to quote just a section of a posting without including the whole thing - I'm still not sure I have but I'm giving it a try (my preview tells me I've got it sussed now). So the blue was to distinguish from my own text. The Red was to highlight that bit of text as I can't see a way to make some text bold.

Anyway, it's not really true that I've already made up my mind - as I said at the end, I want to know if my reasoning is wrong, and I couldn't see anything amongst the replies up to now that said I was wrong for any technical reasons - only ones that highlighted the risk of not complying with manufacturer's instructions, which, despite what ericmark said, a) don't clearly state that it is wrong (apart from the licensed specialist element) and b) I suspect of being over-engineered. Some of the responses appear to be agreeing that it is just over-engineering. But as I said, if somebody knows why this is not over-engineering, I'd be very keen to know that, so that I can avoid a big mistake. Does your "go-ahead mate" mean that you wash your hands of it or that you feel my reasoning is correct? I don't just want to be told "yes you're right" but nor do I want to be told "no you're wrong" without some decent reason.

 

[Pembo]

Your instruction here https://portal.bsh-partner.com/portal(bD1kZSZjPTAwOQ==)/PORTALFRAME.HTM. Is the USER manual - which is what you use.

Where as this
https://portal.bsh-partner.com/portal(bD1kZSZjPTAwOQ==)/PORTALFRAME.HTM is the INSTALLATION manual - which is what we use.

No, I am NOT referring to the user manual, nor have I looked at any document on the internet, I am referring to the document supplied with my appliance that is very clearly entitled "Installation Instructions". I am fully able to distinguish between a user manual and an installation manual. So, once again, for clarity, my quotes are from the printed document enclosed with the appliance entitled "Installation Instructions". I believe it is reasonable to assume that such a document supplied with the appliance has an overriding applicability to my appliance than a document downloaded over the internet that could, for all anybody knows, be relevant to some other variant of the appliance.

I'm not trying to be stroppy or anything, but I am seeking advice that is based on the appliance I have, the documents that have been supplied with it, not some other documents hanging out there in the ether, and working knowledge of what is acceptable practice. Please don't patronise or assume that, if what I am seeing differs from what you are seeing it is automatically me talking out of the wrong aperture.

 

[riveralt]

Does your "go-ahead mate" mean that you wash your hands of it or that you feel my reasoning is correct? I don't just want to be told "yes you're right" but nor do I want to be told "no you're wrong" without some decent reason.

As well as the issues over warranty of the product you have purchased, I also made reference to BS7671 which although not legally enforceable, are recognised as good practice by the Building Regulations.

I specifically mentioned section 134.1.1, which states,'......Electrical equipment shall be installed in accordance with the instructions provided by the manufacturer of the equipment'.

The installation instructions are quite clear in that you shound not connect this equipment to the electrical supply via a plug containing a 13amp fuse and that you should have an all pole isolation switch.
In these circumstance you should:
Check you have the right cable size for the appliance.
Check you have the correct MCB for the cable size and power of the appliance.
Check you have a 45Amp Cooker Switch through which the circuit goes either directly to the oven or via a cooker connection unit.

The hypothetical debate of whether this process is over engineered is neither here nor there - it probably is - but so what!

Its your cooker - I cannot decide for you - if I was the spark you called in then I would follow the instructions above.

 

[riveralt]

No, I am NOT referring to the user manual, nor have I looked at any document on the internet, I am referring to the document supplied with my appliance that is very clearly entitled "Installation Instructions". I am fully able to distinguish between a user manual and an installation manual. So, once again, for clarity, my quotes are from the printed document enclosed with the appliance entitled "Installation Instructions". I believe it is reasonable to assume that such a document supplied with the appliance has an overriding applicability to my appliance than a document downloaded over the internet that could, for all anybody knows, be relevant to some other variant of the appliance.

I'm not trying to be stroppy or anything, but I am seeking advice that is based on the appliance I have, the documents that have been supplied with it, not some other documents hanging out there in the ether, and working knowledge of what is acceptable practice. Please don't patronise or assume that, if what I am seeing differs from what you are seeing it is automatically me talking out of the wrong aperture.

I'm not sure what you want me to say - as an electrician, with the knowledge I have gleaned about this oven, I would connect it via the correct cable size to a cooker connection unit - which would be connected to a dual pole cooker switch and onto an MCB of whatever rating was required. If you wish to do otherwise I cannot stop you.

 

[Grizzly]

I believe it is reasonable to assume that such a document supplied with the appliance has an overriding applicability to my appliance than a document downloaded over the internet that could, for all anybody knows, be relevant to some other variant of the appliance.

It's quite clearly stated in the 'Technical specs' for the HBN331E0B on the Bosch website that the current is 16A, so a 13A plug or 13A FCU would be out of the question:
http://www.bosch-home.co.uk/HBN331E0B.html

 

[ericmark]

We as remote from your house can only go by what Bosch say on their web site. As I said they say 16A and must not use 13A fuse so from web site you can't plug in.

However your post says under 3Kw which as you say means you could plug in. So assuming you have read that information from the plate on the appliance it would seem it is incorrectly badged.

That being the case we being remote can't really comment on what to do. There are grey imports which do not comply with British regulations or do not comply with manufactures information for products supplied to UK.

So with best will in the world we can't give you an answer. However I would think there would be a good reason for the manufacture to state don't use 13A fuse. And personally I would not take the chance and would not use a 13A supply.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

If you look at installation instructions it states "Do not connect with 13A plug or 13A fuse" and it also states current 16A.

I can't see either of those in that doc you linked to....

From P4 - "Do not connect the appliance using a 13a plug or protect it with a 13a fuse"

How bizarre.

I didn't spot it when I looked at the doc (shameful ).

But try searching for 13A in it....

 

[ban-all-sheds]

The blue was not my text - it was an extract from one of the posted replies, I hadn't worked out how to quote just a section of a posting without including the whole thing

Highlight the section you want and click the Quote button, a bit like the way you highlighted a section and changed it to blue.

The Red was to highlight that bit of text as I can't see a way to make some text bold.

Highlight the section you want and click the B button, a bit like the way you highlighted the section and changed it to red.

Anyway, it's not really true that I've already made up my mind - as I said at the end, I want to know if my reasoning is wrong

Write to Bosch and ask them to explain the discrepancy between the specs saying it's a 16A device and must not be on a 13A fuse and the rating plate on the device itself.

 

[1john]

Write to Bosch and ask them to explain the discrepancy between the specs saying it's a 16A device and must not be on a 13A fuse and the rating plate on the device itself.

Splendid idea, hopefully someone will respond to you and you won't have a cut and paste response.

 

[Jaymack]

The regulations - BS7671 allow 2kW maximum for an oven on a final ring circuit. There's always a reason!

Regards