wood floor underlay

[encom80]

Hi There,

I am about to buy some underlay for new solid wood flooring I am installing in a few weeks.

Does anyone have experience with Platon stop (blue rubber type stuff) or Duralay Silent Gold? Would Duralay SilentGold be suitable for solid wood flooring?

The underlay will go over a mixture of green floor board and concrete on the ground floor. Wood is 300mm wide, 28mm thick with varying lengths up to 7m. The instructions for the wood are secretly screwed with 55mm screws. Would this also pierce the underlay and make it useless?

I am removing existing solid wood floor t & g that has all cupped/warped due to previous owner not putting down any underlay whatsoever.

Thanks all!!!

 

[mattysupra]

screws or cleats in the instructions.

And cupping warping etc has nothing to do with no underlay. That is caused by moister. How old is the concrete section?

 

[encom80]

screws or cleats in the instructions.

And cupping warping etc has nothing to do with no underlay. That is caused by moister. How old is the concrete section?

instructions for the new floor to go down are 55mm screws screwed secretly that can be used in concrete also if a pilot hole is 1st drilled.
There are a few ways to install in the instructions which are:

1:Floating by installing dpm, then 22mm floorboard, then 500gsm card, then the actually wood floor secretly screwed

2: DPM, then wedge, then joist, then wood floor secretly screwed

The concrete sections is almost 5 yrs old so moisture shouldn't be a problem anymore as I think the previous owner stuck the old solid wood down before the moisture levels subsided.

I think the rest of the ground floor with the green floorbaord is over a concrete base on wedges/batons.

Whats the best way to go ahead???

 

[mattysupra]

just re read the size of your boards.

Is it defo a solid or engineered product? Any chance you can email me the instructions?

I would of said its a glue down product only. This would mean no underlay but alot of prep work to your subfloors.

 

[mattysupra]

add me as friend so i can send email address.

 

[encom80]

add me as friend so i can send email address.

hi matty,

i just have!

thanks

 

[mattysupra]

recived the instructions and just read them .

There are alot of things wrong in them instructions! Have you purchased this flooring yet?


Basically they are saying that you need to install on a battern system or direct to the concrete and FACE screw the planks down!

Those planks are way to wide to secret nail like they have suggested also. They say you have to screw through the tongue and not use cleats at that also.

You do realise that this flooring will need to be properly sanded and sealed after install dont you?

Also ignor what there saying about moister/humidity, its all wrong. On the first page they state the moister has to be below 85%! Well british standard states it needs to be below 75% and for solid wood it needs to be below 65%.

You may also note that there warranty is void if humidity changes!

Also the expansion they cant just state leave 10-15mm and not tell you what size of area this is sutible for. I cant see any where about width size of rooms to the expansion needed.

Then there is aclimatising, if i read right they state you can fit the same day as delivery if humidity is 50%????? If its not 50% then you need to leave it 24 hrs only

They also say you can screw direct to chipboard? I think not.



Im going to say i would not be following the instructions, if it was me i would install plywood screwed all over to both concrete and chipboard area with a tar paper between them. (making sure moister of concrete is o.k) Then i would be fully bonding the flooring down to the plywood.

Simples !

 

[encom80]

recived the instructions and just read them .

There are alot of things wrong in them instructions! Have you purchased this flooring yet?


Basically they are saying that you need to install on a battern system or direct to the concrete and FACE screw the planks down!

Those planks are way to wide to secret nail like they have suggested also. They say you have to screw through the tongue and not use cleats at that also.

You do realise that this flooring will need to be properly sanded and sealed after install dont you?

Also ignor what there saying about moister/humidity, its all wrong. On the first page they state the moister has to be below 85%! Well british standard states it needs to be below 75% and for solid wood it needs to be below 65%.

You may also note that there warranty is void if humidity changes!

Also the expansion they cant just state leave 10-15mm and not tell you what size of area this is sutible for. I cant see any where about width size of rooms to the expansion needed.

Then there is aclimatising, if i read right they state you can fit the same day as delivery if humidity is 50%????? If its not 50% then you need to leave it 24 hrs only

They also say you can screw direct to chipboard? I think not.



Im going to say i would not be following the instructions, if it was me i would install plywood screwed all over to both concrete and chipboard area. (making sure moister of concrete is o.k) Then i would be fully bonding the flooring down to the plywood.

Simples !

Thanks for the info Matty!
What thickness of marine Ply would you recommend and would I need any DPM like Silent Gold underlay??

Also the expansion gaps, should I just make it all 15mm to be on the safe side? I have 25mm thick skirting to go on afterwards.

 

[mattysupra]

first of i would be getting the moister of the concrete checked to see if its below 75% rh using a hygrometer designed for reading floors. Ideally you want it closer to 65% and below.

If its not below that amout you need to sort the problem out with a epoxy dpm or better still a dpm wood glue that you can bond the plywood down with at the same time. Saves on the drilling and plugging etc.

Next i would be looking for maybe 18mm+ plywood. On the chipboard side just screw it down watching for pipes underneath.

Make sure its a good quality wbp product that sits flat and is not warped to death (chinnese import rubbish)

Next get yourself a sutible adhesive like a 'sika' product to full bond the boards to the plywood.

note- no underlay of any kind is used. If the moister of the concrete is correct then lay a tar paper over the whole area under the plywood.

The expansion will depend on the size of the area. I would say about 20mm minimum on a 4-5 meter wide room.

Make sure you aclimatise the wood for a few week s in the property. The property should be heated and all wet works like plaster work finished.

you will need some clamps to clamp the flooring together as the glue sets unless its milled to perfection, i guess it wont be after reading there instructions.

 

[encom80]

first of i would be getting the moister of the concrete checked to see if its below 75% rh using a hygrometer designed for reading floors. Ideally you want it closer to 65% and below.

If its not below that amout you need to sort the problem out with a epoxy dpm or better still a dpm wood glue that you can bond the plywood down with at the same time. Saves on the drilling and plugging etc.

Next i would be looking for maybe 18mm+ plywood. On the chipboard side just screw it down watching for pipes underneath.

Make sure its a good quality wbp product that sits flat and is not warped to death (chinnese import rubbish)

Next get yourself a sutible adhesive like a 'sika' product to full bond the boards to the plywood.

note- no underlay of any kind is used. If the moister of the concrete is correct then lay a tar paper over the whole area under the plywood.

The expansion will depend on the size of the area. I would say about 20mm minimum on a 4-5 meter wide room.

Make sure you aclimatise the wood for a few week s in the property. The property should be heated and all wet works like plaster work finished.

you will need some clamps to clamp the flooring together as the glue sets unless its milled to perfection, i guess it wont be after reading there instructions.

Hi thanks again for the tips!!!!

For the concrete section, this is almost 5 yrs old, would I need to check the moisture still?

Is there any way of a screw down option, as I would like to take the board up if need be in the future?


cheers!

 

[mattysupra]

it still needs testing, some concretes can take 20+ years to dry, also you have no proof that you have a working DPM under it, there may be one there but how would you know if there is a hole in it? You would be amazed how many new concrete floors have a damaged dpm.

As for screw down? what do you mean? The new flooring or the plywood?

If you are talking the new flooring, well you can screw it down like the instructions say. But i would be amazed if it will stay down with no problems.

Why would you want to take it up? it would be a solid fixing that would have no reason to be taken up in the future unless it fails or you need to get under it. Normally i would make a trap in another room so you can crawl under it.

 

[encom80]

it still needs testing, some concretes can take 20+ years to dry, also you have no proof that you have a working DPM under it, there may be one there but how would you know if there is a hole in it? You would be amazed how many new concrete floors have a damaged dpm.

As for screw down? what do you mean? The new flooring or the plywood?

If you are talking the new flooring, well you can screw it down like the instructions say. But i would be amazed if it will stay down with no problems.

Why would you want to take it up? it would be a solid fixing that would have no reason to be taken up in the future unless it fails or you need to get under it. Normally i would make a trap in another room so you can crawl under it.

Thanks M.

Thought of taking it up if I ever needed to do any future work to the house like an extension or chasing new wires in!

Do you know anywhere doing good quality ply at reasonable rates?

cheers again!

 

[mattysupra]

try your local timber yard, if no good then go to B&Q warehouse. They at least store the stuff in doors rather than an out side shed thats not heated etc and full of moister.

 

[encom80]

try your local timber yard, if no good then go to B&Q warehouse. They at least store the stuff in doors rather than an out side shed thats not heated etc and full of moister.

would I need marine ply or would normal ply be ok? marine ply is so exp!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[mattysupra]

wbp. marine is over kill.