Ading sockets throughout house

[round01]

a family member has asked if I could possible do some work in the new house she is moving into. replacing socket and switch faces ect - but she has also asked if I could add sockets to each room.

What is the best way of doing this??

for example there are 2 double sockets in her lounge and she wants another 3, should I find the feed and extend the ring or spur off the existing socket with a FCU and run them?

its a similar story for the kitchen, and two bedrooms.

any help would be appreciated.

Thanks

 

[Greenie9657]

Hi

Im sure youll get plenty of advise on here matey. But as a quick answer i would try and trace the exsisting wiring and break the ring, then you can add as many as you like without the need for "ugly" FCUs. You can only spur once from any socket so im not sure you'd have enough anyway. Any further questions feel free to post.

Regards

 

[plugwash]

In general i'd say where possible it's better to insert the sockets into the ring than add spurs.

I'd say the first thing to do is to trace the existing wiring. Once you know how the existing wiring is done you can then start working out how you are going to modify it.

 

[ericmark]

If you follow the IET/BSI recommended method to work on an electrical system needs you to be able to use, and have assess to test equipment.

Also again following the BS7671 you need RCD protection to many items including sockets under 20A and cables buried in the wall at less than 50 m unless using the special cables.

For the DIY guy who likely does not have the test equipment and has no intention of buying or hiring it he clearly must brake the rules but to what extent is really up to him.

So quoting rules would seem pointless it's more down to a risk assessment. Likely the best method is to fit RCD FCU then a sting of sockets from them so the loop impedance is unlikely to be a problem and you have included RCD protection on all new cables and sockets.

However as an electrician I would be adding RCD protection at the consumer unit if required and likely after measuring loop impedance extending the ring.

Since she is the new occupier she should have an electrical installation condition report which should detail the loop impedance measured so armed with those figures you can work out if there is any leeway to extend the ring. But for anyone on here to advice you must first give us those figures.

My sons method was to remove all the ceilings and rewire but that is rather a drastic option. So what did the report say?

When you say "new house" does that mean new to her or newly built?

 

[Greenie9657]

one thing is wish id done is not tell everyone i can do it. now everyone wants them doing .

Make sure you check its dead before you begin work even though you have popped the MCB. Buy a Fluke/Multimeter. £20 screwfix

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Buy a Fluke/Multimeter. £20 screwfix

Buy a set of proper test equipment. £200-ish on eBay

 

[Greenie9657]

Buy a Fluke/Multimeter. £20 screwfix

Buy a set of proper test equipment. £200-ish on eBay

bit excessive for a DIYer sheds.

 

[phatboy]

Buy a Fluke/Multimeter. £20 screwfix

Buy a set of proper test equipment. £200-ish on eBay

Can you suggest a decent set? For a DIYer.....

 

[Monkeh]

one thing is wish id done is not tell everyone i can do it. now everyone wants them doing .

Make sure you check its dead before you begin work even though you have popped the MCB. Buy a Fluke/Multimeter. £20 screwfix

This is not a Fluke, it is a ripoff, and it may well not even be safe to use on the mains.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

bit excessive for a DIYer sheds.

Life is full of choices.

People don't have to pay for room upgrades or seat upgrades or hire car upgrades when they go on holiday, but many do.

People don't have to take up golf and buy expensive clubs, but many of those who do the former then do the latter.

People don't have to put wider, lower profile tyres on their cars, but many do.

The cost of acquiring the means to test their electrical work is not beyond many people, they just choose not to incur it. That choice is incompatible with choosing to do significant electrical work.

I accept that there are some for whom it is out of reach, probably an increasing number, just as are holidays, golf clubs and low profile alloy wheels, but there is no exemption from the laws of physics on the grounds of economic hardship.

 

[round01]

its an old council house with 2 doubles in the lounge and one double in each bedroom. The c/u is the old wylex with the fuse wire mcb's which I will change to the b type wylex.

She just wants to add sockets in each room without having to chase up all the walls so I suggested adding a fcu or RCD fcu off one socket in each room and running the 2.5 under the floor to each new point in that room behind the skirting. is that possible and safe??

Kitchen will have to be chased up - I was intending on spurring off one of the exisiting sockets to add 2 more in the kitchen but she also wants 2 x 1G socket under the worktop controlled by another FCU above (for her washing mchine, tumble dryer ect) im assuming all that wouldn't work off one spured socket?

If you follow the IET/BSI recommended method to work on an electrical system needs you to be able to use, and have assess to test equipment.

Also again following the BS7671 you need RCD protection to many items including sockets under 20A and cables buried in the wall at less than 50 m unless using the special cables.

For the DIY guy who likely does not have the test equipment and has no intention of buying or hiring it he clearly must brake the rules but to what extent is really up to him.

So quoting rules would seem pointless it's more down to a risk assessment. Likely the best method is to fit RCD FCU then a sting of sockets from them so the loop impedance is unlikely to be a problem and you have included RCD protection on all new cables and sockets.

However as an electrician I would be adding RCD protection at the consumer unit if required and likely after measuring loop impedance extending the ring.

Since she is the new occupier she should have an electrical installation condition report which should detail the loop impedance measured so armed with those figures you can work out if there is any leeway to extend the ring. But for anyone on here to advice you must first give us those figures.

My sons method was to remove all the ceilings and rewire but that is rather a drastic option. So what did the report say?

When you say "new house" does that mean new to her or newly built?

 

[bernardgreen]

Buy a set of proper test equipment. £200-ish on eBay

With bit of luck it might also be accurish and possibly safish as well.

Or it might be a cheap, in-accurate, un-safe rip off clone of the real thing made by a back street criminal in the far east. It will of course come with a forged set of calibration results.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Can you suggest a decent set? For a DIYer.....

Apart from some recent Chinese entrants to the market, about which I know SFA, and about which I wonder if I'm being dismissive because they are so cheap and might also be absolutely fine, they are all decent.

Fluke, Megger, Robin (now part of Fluke, I believe), Metrel, Kewtech,
Seaward...

A lesser known make (which therefore attracts lower prices ) is Beha aka Unitest aka Telaris - a German company also now part of the Fluke empire.

Don't worry about 16th Edition / 17th Edition labels - there was no change in the testing requirements but all the makers brought out new kit to capitalise. Sadly the flood of perfectly good equipment sold off by electricians bamboozled into thinking they needed to replace theirs has now gone. If it's foreign and says VDE100 that will do the job too.

Start looking on eBay - remember you can get individual instruments instead of a multifunction one (there are 3 needed), and the way that they are divided up means you can mix'n'match from different makers. I would strongly advise only buying ones which have a recent calibration certificate, unless the price is stunningly good and you don't mind taking a risk. Any decent seller with working kit for sale which is out of calibration ought to be happy to agree to make the sale conditional on him getting it calibrated (at your expense) before finalising the deal.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

With bit of luck it might also be accurish and possibly safish as well.

Or it might be a cheap, in-accurate, un-safe rip off clone of the real thing made by a back street criminal in the far east. It will of course come with a forged set of calibration results.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/Electrical-Test-Equipment-/92074/i.html?_sop=15&_nkw=multifunction+tester

 

[plugwash]

its an old council house with 2 doubles in the lounge and one double in each bedroom. The c/u is the old wylex with the fuse wire mcb's which I will change to the b type wylex.

She just wants to add sockets in each room without having to chase up all the walls so I suggested adding a fcu or RCD fcu off one socket in each room and running the 2.5 under the floor to each new point in that room behind the skirting. is that possible and safe??

There is no "safe zone" at the bottom of a wall (even though there is one at the top). So any concealed cable running along behind the skirting board (cables going from an accessory to the underfloor space are ok because they are in the safe zone defined by the accessory) must be installed in a way that is suitable for outside the safe zones. Practically speaking that means either special cable types or steel conduit.