Is PAT testing law?

[markymark2406]

Does PAT testing need to be done by law? This doc seems to say the opposite:

http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg236.pdf

 

[westie101]

As the document is published by the enforcing authority it does correctly state the legal position.
I'm sure that companies that sell PAT testing will tell you differently but they are a business and need to make a profit

 

[AdrianUK]

No, PAT testing is not law.

BUT, an employer needs to show that he has taken steps to ensure that the working environment is safe. That also includes the electrical & electronic appliances used by employees.

One method of proving that an employer has taken 'reasonable steps' to ensure electrical safety is having documented evidence that the items of electrical equipment have been inspected & tested by a competent person aka the PAT test.

 

[Astra99]

I fully endorse AdrianUK's reply. Portable Appliance Testing is merely a means to an end, not a specific requirement per se.

 

[JohnW2]

One method of proving that an employer has taken 'reasonable steps' to ensure electrical safety is having documented evidence that the items of electrical equipment have been inspected & tested by a competent person aka the PAT test.

Quite so. Much the same concept as using compliance with BS7671 as a means of demonstrating that the "reasonable provisions" (or whatever the word is) required for compliance with Part P have been satisfied. Compliance with BS7671 is not required by law, but complying with BS7671 is the easiest (and almost universal) way of demonstrating that one has complied with the law.

Kind REgards, John

 

[securespark]

The Electricity At Work Regulations 1989 are enshrined in law.

PAT testing is not law, but EAWR 1989 is.

Tend to agree with John. If it came to your ass being in the dock, I would breathe easier being able to say to the judge, I have PAT tested these appliances using the approved gear and methods, I have the appropriate training to do so and have kept appropriate records of said testing.

Rather than,

Yeah, OK, guv, it's like this. PAT testing ain't law so I have no proper gear but I've tested everything with my Megger and it looked OK. I can't be responsible for what other people do, can I?

 

[bernardgreen]

When I was young people using portable electrical equipment tended to look at the cables and things and if they looked worn or damaged they were taken somewhere to be repaired.

People don't bother to do that anymore as the PAT label is a sign that it is not un-safe to use.

 

[ericmark]

Under health and safety laws all reports have to be in writing and it is this fact which means there is a grey area when using the old method of just looking at an item and removing it if it looks as though it needs repair.

However how much needs to be written is something else so doing a walk of the factory/office floor every morning/week/month/year and writing in diary morning inspection completed no faults found would likely be enough to say the report was in writing.

There is no need for labels for a small shop with one kettle, one till, one fan etc then a simple report kettle, till, and fan tested all OK in a diary with a signature is enough.

When I did a health and safety talk I would before the talk put a test paper on the table which the worker could fill in during the talk I did not want any failures and the paper showed they had not fallen asleep and had understood all that had been said there could be no claims after that they did not understand English since there were many Welsh speakers.

Its all about getting it down in writing be it text message, email, or paper does not matter but speech is not good enough.

I personally feel we go to far with PAT testing the mobile phone charger only really needs a visual inspection. Yes I know we can measure the current it uses and if it isolates but really this is not required.

With Class I machines the earth does need checking and there are some items which seem prone to developing faults. Cordless kettle is a good example often find these with a faulty earth connection and as such need testing every 6 months.

But the simple kettle is a good example of the problems with PAT testing I have seen damaged elements where copper is being leached into the water but still electrical sound so it gets a OK sticker even when it's not OK to use due to some non electrical fault. As to if copper is really a problem not sure we use to put it in cheese! But same applies to grinders with missing guard.

Items like grinders often cause arguments where the trigger can be latched on is this 1) permitted 2) part of a PAT test?

There are many mechanical faults with can be cured electrically and also many different ways of curing an electrical problem. The grinder problem is a good example using an active RCD would mean it complies as it will not auto re-start after a power cut.

But on my PAT testing course this was never talked about and PAT testing for an electrician is boring and often it is a job given to semi-skilled people who will likely miss many faults so real terms PAT testing as it is done at the moment is not really fit for the purposes of ensuring safety.

So if one finds a piece of plastic without the BS 1363 marking with no electrical connections to the plastic, but shoved into a 13A socket does that item require PAT testing, and should it be given a fail label as it is not marked BS 1363?

 

[Spark123]

Good question, our stance is that a visual inspection is sufficient for items like mobile phone chargers as not a lot more can be done.
Looking at my iPhone charger it has a CE mark and some sort of safety marking, no British standard on it. As I know it is genuine I would pass it as safe to use.
The bigger problem you may find is where people bring their own chargers into an establishment which they bought for 99p off ebay!

 

[westie101]

If you take note of the HSE document it states: -

Double insulated equipment
Class II equipment is sometimes referred to as ‘double insulated’ equipment. Thismeans that there is extra insulation within the construction of the equipment toprevent accidental contact with live parts, even if there is a fault.

Class II equipment does not need an earth connection to maintain safety. It will not need a portable appliance test, although you should ensure that user checks and visual inspections are carried out as the integrity of the equipment casing is a key safety feature.

So if anyone is PAT testing this gear and charging they should be careful as they could be challenged by whoever is paying the bill.

P'S. do not PAT testers exist as they remove the risk of frying electronics that exist if a megger is used?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

As to if copper is really a problem not sure we use to put it in cheese! But same applies to grinders with missing guard.

I don't think anybody has ever put grinders with missing guards in cheese.

But given the lunacy of some cheese-despoilers, it's probably only a matter of time.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Portable Appliance Testing testing

 

[ericmark]

Portable Appliance Testing testing

We also refer to DOS operating system and many others in the same way. "IaToIsEE" I suppose should used instead of PAT as we also have to test items which do not fall within the description of portable. But just like DOS should be called CLI but many would no understand what a CLI is so we call Inspection and testing of in-service electrical equipment PAT and well call it Pat not P. A. T. in the same way as we call radio direction and ranging Radar and it has become a word in it's own right.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

We also refer to DOS operating system

Yup.

And PIN number, LCD display, TUC congress....

Oh and Mississippi means "big river", so "Mississippi River" is "big river river".

"Sahara" means desert.

"Faroe" means sheep island.

If you want one closer to home, "Humber" means river.

And for one much closer to home for you, "bre" is the old Celtic word for hill, and "don" the old English word for hill.

So here's a photo of Hillhill Hill:

But just like DOS should be called CLI

No it shouldn't. An OS may have a CLI, but the CLI is not the OS.

but many would no understand what a CLI is

Indeed.

 

[westie101]

So here's a photo of Hillhill Hill:

We have a village in the area Torpenhow,Tor, Pen & How are all words in various languages for hill
So another version Hillhillhill![/quote]