Ceiling roses with only 2 terminals?

[stonehouse]

Hello,

I recently purchased some antique ceiling roses (bakelite material). Inside there's only 2 terminals, so where do I connect the earth cable to?

 

[stem]

Lighting circuits generally installed in homes before the 1960's didn't include earth conductors, as their components were Bakelite and plastic. There wasn't any exposed metal as such to earth, so didn't need a provision for an earth connection. As such they are not really suitable for use today. However you may be able to add a new earth terminal if there is space to do so safely.

 

[JohnD]

some of these old switches have domed covers that can be unscrewed by hand (no tools required) and may have brass dolly switches. Some of them have brass domes. None of these are safe to use.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Indeed.

But enough about switches - what about ceiling roses?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I recently purchased some antique ceiling roses (bakelite material). Inside there's only 2 terminals, so where do I connect the earth cable to?

How are you planning to use them?

 

[stonehouse]

Thanks guys.

I recently purchased an old house (circa 1880) and it's currently undergoing a major refurbishment. I would like to use bakelite electrical accessories as I think modern plastic won't look right in an old house.

Here are some pictures. Are these safe? If not, can they be modified by swapping internals from later electrical accessories?

 

[333rocky333]

I think in later years they strarted to fit ceiling roses on round patresses that included an earth terminal, but I suppose a small connecter block could be used within the housing.
I only ever see patresses in white though similar to these.
I think Mk still sell white ones for use with old style Batten Holders

 

[winston1]

Your ceiling roses are definitely old, probably just post war. Pre war they would have been made of porcelain. The switch is relatively modern, late 60's. It will probably be supplied with 4BA screws which you will need to replace with M3.5 to fit a modern flush box.

No doubt the next owner of your house will rip them all out and replace with the latest fashion.

 

[JohnW2]

I recently purchased an old house (circa 1880) and it's currently undergoing a major refurbishment. I would like to use bakelite electrical accessories as I think modern plastic won't look right in an old house.

I wouldn't think that the material is much of an issue. Modern brown plastic does not look dissimilar to bakelite - it's more shiny, but that can be rectified by judicious use of some kitchen/bathroom abrasive paste cleaner (or even fine sandpaper)! Much of my house is of a similar vintage to yours (although some parts date from the 1700s), and I adopted that ploy in some places.

However, the main issue is style, rather than material - but if you look around (and are prepared to spend a bit of money) you will find that there are sources of ('electrically') modern electrical accessories which emulate quite well the appearance of the accessories of yesteryear.

Kind Regards, John

 

[EFLImpudence]

Eighteenth century ceiling roses and switches are worth a fortune.

 

[JohnW2]

Eighteenth century ceiling roses and switches are worth a fortune.

I'm sure they would be, and would imagine that gas or oil might come out if one manages to switch one on

However, the point surely is that, even if inevitably not 'true to period', things which look like pre-WWII electrical accessories would be perceived by most people as looking more 'right' in a C17 building than would 21st century white or stainless steel ones!

Kind Regards, John

 

[stonehouse]

some of these old switches have domed covers that can be unscrewed by hand (no tools required) and may have brass dolly switches. Some of them have brass domes. None of these are safe to use.

I'm not sure what you mean. Do you have pictures?

 

[stonehouse]

I think in later years they strarted to fit ceiling roses on round patresses that included an earth terminal, but I suppose a small connecter block could be used within the housing.
I only ever see patresses in white though similar to these.
I think Mk still sell white ones for use with old style Batten Holders

That's a brilliant idea. Does the earth terminal in the pattress (or a small connector block) have to be connected to anything?

What brand is that pattress? I tried to search on Google but could not find it.

And what about for the wall switch? I suppose a flush box with earth terminal?

 

[333rocky333]

I'm not sure what you mean. Do you have pictures?

i think he means the original ones of these, the ones in the pic may be replicas

 

[333rocky333]

That's a brilliant idea. Does the earth terminal in the pattress (or a small connector block) have to be connected to anything?

What brand is that pattress? I tried to search on Google but could not find it.

And what about for the wall switch? I suppose a flush box with earth terminal?

An earthed point should be there regardless if needed

The patress i posted is Hager

http://www.hager.co.uk/product-cata...essories/mb326e-mt/46071.htm?utm_source=print

Them light switches are standard mk size so will fit anything that a new switch of almost any brand will fit.

The earth terminal was mainly to park the earth as it was normally not needed as it was all plastic, however if a metal fitting was too hang on the rose then the earth would join in the terminal and carry the earth through to the fitting.
Same as with a metal switch

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=b...cAKHQMwDgwQ_AUICygC&biw=1707&bih=844&dpr=1.13