What is "Smart" with electric goods?

[Harry Bloomfield]

I may be wrong, but I thought that 'pre-paying' ('topping up') when one has a 'smart' meter is usually done on-line, with a phone 'app' or regularly/automatically by Direct Debit.

Kind Regards, John

https://www.smartenergygb.org/smart-meter-benefits/benefits-for-prepay-customers

 

[JohnW2]

https://www.smartenergygb.org/smart-meter-benefits/benefits-for-prepay-customers

... as I said

Kind Regards, John

 

[scousespark]

Good to see you. I hope all; is well with you and yours.

Are you sure about that? I'm not sure what the "Self" bit really means (it would seem to imply monitoring its own function/performance/whatever), and I wouldn't say that a 'smart' meter does any meaningful "Analysis" (only measuring, storing and communicating/reporting).

I realise that acronyms can (and often do) have multiple meanings, in different fields/context', but, for what it's worth, the only such meaning of 'SMART' of which I've been aware has been the one in relation to "SMART Goals" (in business or life in general), namely: "Specific, Measurable, Achievable, Realistic, and Timely" (and small variations on that theme).

Kind Regards, John

I just google 'Smart technology definition' and the acronym came top of the list.
Just as an exercise I googled TNC and this gave our old favourite along with Trans National Corporation, so context affects results.

 

[JohnW2]

I just google 'Smart technology definition' and the acronym came top of the list.

Fair enough. I did the opposite, Googling "SMART acronym meaning" and (at least after not-very-deep study) didn't see 'your definition' at all - and the one meaning with which I had been familiar (which I mentioned) was at the top of the list.

Just as an exercise I googled TNC and this gave our old favourite along with Trans National Corporation, so context affects results.

Yes, as I said, it is probably the rule, rather than the exception, that acronyms have multiple meanings in different contexts.

However, in the actual context we are discussing, I'm not sure that the definition you found is relevant, because I feel sure that the vast majority, probably nearly all, people believe that, in the context of 'Smart technology', the 'Smart" refers to something along the lines of 'clever' - and it is what the vast majority believes that actually matters (even if, as you have illustrated, there is a technological definition of 'SMART' as an acronym, of which they are unaware), isn't it?

Kind Regards, John

 

[SimonH2]

I may be wrong, but I thought that 'pre-paying' ('topping up') when one has a 'smart' meter is usually done on-line, with a phone 'app' or regularly/automatically by Direct Debit.

Indeed.
And as well as being able to remotely cut you off, you can be switched to pre-pay remotely. Of course, subject to all the same safeguards we all trust

 

[JohnW2]

Indeed. And as well as being able to remotely cut you off, you can be switched to pre-pay remotely. Of course, subject to all the same safeguards we all trust

One interesting thing is that with pre-paying, the meter presumably does have to do just a little 'processing' ('analysis', per scousespark's definition of the 'acronym') (rather than just 'measuring, storing and reporting' data), particularly if it's more than a simple single-rate tariff (are other tariffs available as 'pre-pay', I wonder?) - so maybe they are fractionally 'smarter' when used in pre-pay mode .

Amidst all the concerns (on the part of some people) about (possibly erroneous) 'remote cutting off', presumably ('dumb') pre-payment meters have always 'cut one off' if/when the credit ran out?

Kind Regards, John

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

Amidst all the concerns (on the part of some people) about (possibly erroneous) 'remote cutting off', presumably ('dumb') pre-payment meters have always 'cut one off' if/when the credit ran out?

Good point and I have not come across many of them - mostly the old coin in the slot ones, but they did disconnect when the credit ran out. The modern Smart will likely do the same, but I think I read they do allow a bit of debit before they switch off.

 

[ericmark]

I may be wrong, but I thought that 'pre-paying' ('topping up') when one has a 'smart' meter is usually done on-line, with a phone 'app' or regularly/automatically by Direct Debit.

Kind Regards, John

If you can pay on-line or with a phone 'app' then don't need a pre-pay meter, reason they are fitted is when people are short of money, if short of money broad band and smart phones should be first to go after smoking.

 

[JohnW2]

Good point and I have not come across many of them - mostly the old coin in the slot ones, but they did disconnect when the credit ran out. The modern Smart will likely do the same, but I think I read they do allow a bit of debit before they switch off.

Indeed - and this may be one (small) way in which some pre-pay customers might benefit from having a 'smart' meter.

I presume that, with traditional ('dumb') pre-pay meters, when the money runs out something goes 'clunk' and the electricity goes off - regardless of the customer's circumstances - e.g. if they are particularly 'vulnerable' or, at worst, dependent upon electrically-powered life-supporting etc. equipment (with limited battery backup). However, with 'smart' meters there is presumably enough versatility to allow there to be discretion/margins ('areas of grace') and, as a last resort, the supplier could presumably over-ride a meter's 'intent' to switch off the supply.

Kind Regards, John

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

I presume that, with traditional ('dumb') pre-pay meters, when the money runs out something goes 'clunk' and the electricity goes off - regardless of the customer's circumstances - e.g.

The act of inserting the coins and turning it in, would wind up the mechanism to click open the contacts t the end.

 

[JohnW2]

If you can pay on-line or with a phone 'app' then don't need a pre-pay meter, reason they are fitted is when people are short of money, if short of money broad band and smart phones should be first to go after smoking.

One can also pay 'by telephone' (someone else's if necessary) and maybe in person at the traditional 'top-up places'.

People (and, indeed, society/government) don't necessarily have the priorities which you would regard as sensible/logical. It wouldn't surprise me if a high proportion of those with pre-pay meters do have broadband and/or smartphones (and TVs, and cars etc.) (and a good few also smoke!). Indeed, people with pre-pay meters are by no means necessarily all that 'short of money' - they may just have difficulties in 'managing' money (i.e. have a misguided idea about prioritisation of what they do with the money they have) or may have have history if not being good at paying quarterly bills!

There's seemingly not all that much difference between having a pre-pay meter and, like me (and millions of others) paying for my electricity by monthly Direct Debit. In either case, if the payments stop 'coming' (because potentially 'available money' has been spent on something else), so, sooner or later, will the electricity supply stop.

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

The act of inserting the coins and turning it in, would wind up the mechanism to click open the contacts t the end.

Exactly.

Kind Regards, John

 

[ericmark]

I think the problem is when turning on some one must be there, if putting a card or coin in slot you are there, but you could phone to get supply back from anywhere in the world, so normally it needs some one to attend to turn power back on, yes it seems odd since also loose it with general power cut and that goes back on without some one attending.

And yes seen pre-pay meters in houses where one would assume not short of a penny or two, it seems they were standard fitting in council houses, and they have simply never been changed.

 

[JohnW2]

deleted [pressed 'send' button too soon!]

 

[JohnW2]

I think the problem is when turning on some one must be there, if putting a card or coin in slot you are there, but you could phone to get supply back from anywhere in the world, so normally it needs some one to attend to turn power back on, yes it seems odd since also loose it with general power cut and that goes back on without some one attending.

That's not an issue.

If one runs out of credit (even the leeway provided by 'emergency credit' and extensions thereof) and, as a result, the supply is cut off then, with a smart meter, after one has made a payment (on-line or whatever) one has to go through a process to re-energise the supply. For example, this from SSE ...

There is hence no risk of an 'unaccompanied installation' being re-energised. The same process could (and quite possibly is) also be implemented in relation to re-energising after a 'remote cut off'.

Kind Regards, John