I'm confused about junction box rules

[SUNRAY]

Read the OP again

I did, perhaps you should read the whole thread.

I think you are both saying the same thing regarding access

 

[chivers67]

They are & Murdo didn't quote Dave's post but blup's

 

[blup]

They are & Murdo didn't quote Dave's post but blup's

Looks like it.

 

[blup]

The customer cannot be expected to know if an MF junction box is required. If the customer informed the electrician the the junction box was going to be enclosed behind plasterboard, then the electrician has a duty to exercise reasonable skill and care in doing the job and therefore should have installed an MF junction box.

The OP knew what the regs said, if he accepted a quote for a non MF jb that is the contract. If a builder builds an extension that has no planning permission he still gets paid. It may be unprofessional but we have not heard what the sparky has to say or seen the pics.

 

[securespark]

I think I'd be using MF regardless.

 

[Murdochcat]

The OP knew what the regs said, if he accepted a quote for a non MF jb that is the contract. If a builder builds an extension that has no planning permission he still gets paid. It may be unprofessional but we have not heard what the sparky has to say or seen the pics.

Rubbish. Most home owners aren’t aware of the requirement for a MF connections and as the spark knew the plan, it was up to him to supply and fit the appropriate parts

 

[SUNRAY]

The OP knew what the regs said, if he accepted a quote for a non MF jb that is the contract. If a builder builds an extension that has no planning permission he still gets paid. It may be unprofessional but we have not heard what the sparky has to say or seen the pics.

But if this is correct:

the electrician I've just used has connected an outside light via an old style junction box. The junction box is in the ceiling of the under the stairs cupboard, which I'm about to plasterboard and then plaster over (he knew that was the plan).

the electrician has to use a product that will conform with the regs at completion and didn't need to specify what materials he would be using.

Working on your (blup's) principle newbuilds can have 'old style' JBs in the ceilings.

 

[chivers67]

I think I'd be using MF regardless.

I use nothing other than them now, I find them much easier to terminate cables especially the Ashley boxes with cable fixings too.

 

[SUNRAY]

Personally I haven't fitted a JB for years, for maybe a decade I've only had to repair at failure of somesort and all have been MF. I think 4 maybe 5 occasions.
Obviousely over the decades I've also encountered faulty screw terminations but I think I'm safe to say all have been due to workmanship or overload, with MF it's not easy or even impossible to find the reason.

 

[PotatoSoup]

Hi, I'm so sorry - I hadn't realised this conversation had continued. I've attached photos

 

[PotatoSoup]

The OP knew what the regs said, if he accepted a quote for a non MF jb that is the contract. If a builder builds an extension that has no planning permission he still gets paid. It may be unprofessional but we have not heard what the sparky has to say or seen the pics.

I didn't know that part of the regs at the time - I'm curious about electrics so know a bit but I'm not qualified in any way and I'm very far away from being an expert.

 

[JohnW2]

The OP knew what the regs said, ...

From what I can make out, I don't think he did know at the time (and couldn't be expected to know, anyway) but, in any event ...

if he accepted a quote for a non MF jb that is the contract.

Firstly, I rather doubt that the quote/contract will have explicitly mentioned a "non-MF JB" - much more likely that, if it mentioned the JB at all, it simply said 'JB', with a reasonably expectation that the electrician would use an appropriate and compliant type of product (given that we are told that the electrician knew that the JB would not be accessible).

Secondly, as above, even if the quote/contract had explicitly specified a 'non-MF JB', the customer cannot be expected to know that such would not be acceptable (given that the electrician knew that the JB would be inaccessible), the expectation being that a competent electrician would quote for, and undertake, work that was compliant with regs.

If a builder builds an extension that has no planning permission he still gets paid.

That's different, since there is a ('bureaucratic') obligation on the property owner to get planning permission, which is different from an (unreasonable) expectation that a customer would have technical knowledge. For example, if the builder quoted for, and undertook, work which was structurally inadequate (maybe 'unsafe'), one could not expect the customer to have necessarily been aware of, and prevented, that problem.

 

[bernardgreen]

A friend bought a cottage and discovered this DIY installation behind a hard board panel

A 230 Volt ring main was looped along the junction boxes and each socket in the house had a cable from it's "own" junction box.

Door bell wiring ( ELV ) used the larger junction boxes.

 

[PotatoSoup]

A friend bought a cottage and discovered this DIY installation behind a hard board panel

View attachment 395907
A 230 Volt ring main was looped along the junction boxes and each socket in the house had a cable from it's "own" junction box.

Door bell wiring ( ELV ) used the larger junction boxes.

Gosh!! That looks a little eccentric but is it ok in terms of the regs?

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

A 230 Volt ring main was looped along the junction boxes and each socket in the house had a cable from it's "own" junction box.

Did the regulations once permit, up to two single sockets, spurred off from a single point of the ring?