Another Ecotec problem!

[Hack]

hi,
I didn't want to hijack another thread so have started a new one.
I have an ecotec plus 831 that developed an f.75 fault thursday night.
I thought it was low pressure (have had low pressure before and the pressure gauge was low) so filled it up a little and switched it back on. This seemed to work but then pressure went high (as I'd poss overfilled)so I bled the lowest rad and it seemed ok. Then it came back so I looked it up and f.75 relates to poss a faulty pressure sensor which looking at other posts appears to be a common fault with this unit. It's about 2 1/2 years old now.
Anyway, was without heating most of the afternoon but arranged for an engineer to look at it. Got the address from the Valliant website of a local company.
So the guy turns up about 4pm and I mention the fault code to him but he doesn't seem to interested and I kind of leave him to it. He looked at the expansion tank and said not much air in so pumped in more air with a handheld pump and then starts it up and checks pipes etc - and pressure seems to be ok and no fault.
Eventually after an hour I ask him how he's getting on and he says that the safety valve has kicked in and the unit is discharging a little externally although both the gauge and the digital display show about 1.8 so he reckons that it might be a faulty sensor that needs replacing.
I didn't have a great deal of confidence in him initially so I asked him what he's been doing for the last hour and he replies that he's been doing basic checks. I questioned why he didn't just replace the part (I know it's a cheap part) and he said that the fault code is just a guide and he wouldn't have been able to get a part at 4pm anyway, but can come back on Monday.
At this stage I wasn't particularly happy about the time taken to diagnose this so said I would think about it over the weekend. I paid the callout but in my haste forgot to ask for a job sheet.
I'm sorry for the long post/rant but would appreciate any thoughts as to whether I'm over-reacting or should I have expected better service? Is what the engineer did normal practice? I personally feel that he could have got a part (I had mentioned the fault code to the callhandler) and then tested for other problems. The fault has now returned and I'm now potentially without heating for the whole weekend.
I'm tempted to complain to vaillaint about this and also to the company as I feel it's been poor service. As I mentioned I don't have a job sheet and have paid by chq. Should I ask for a refund?
In particular if anyone in the trade could answer that would be great.
Many Thanks

 

[Agile]

It sounds as if you called a callout company.

You should be able to guess that their prime objective to to charge as much as possible.

I suspect repressurising the EXV was a required repair and the correct thing to do.

Did you offer him a cofffee?

You dont say what the gauge is reading now that you presumably have a F75 code again.

Nor do you say if its now low and if you have increased it.

You dont say where you are or why you chose this company and in particular why you choose them instead of a local independent.

Tony

 

[gas4you]

F75, in reality, has nothing to do with system pressure, other than it is caused my the board not 'seeing' a 0.2 Bar pressure increase when the pump starts.

First thing he should have done was remove the pressure sensor and see if it just needed cleaning, then failing that, went and got a new one.

Replacement parts for boilers this new can often be somewhat of a problem though, for an independent, so on this point he may have been correct.

Generally though you seem to have had an idiot out who was hell bent on making the job last as long as possible

 

[Hack]

Hi Tony and thanks for replying.
Don't know what an evx is but am guessing it's the expansion vessel.
I offer coffee/ tea as a matter of course!
The gauge is now not reading anything and the digital reader is @ 0.5
I can't increase it again as for some reason nothing now happens when I turn on the cold tap.
I chose the company as they were local to me and I found them through the local installer function on the valliant website. Not entirely sure what the problem is with doing that?
I also urgently needed someone to come out as although I was at work, have a pregnant partner and 2 1/2 year old at home so need this fixed.

 

[Hack]

hi Dave and thanks for your response too
having read a reply to a previous poster from you
//www.diynot.com/forums/viewto...ghlight=&sid=c6698a314641ddaa9b096c7608d1e2ed that's what I figured.
Have spoken to a parts company and am off to pick it up now.
Will post back later

 

[Hack]

Hi Dave,
I've had a look at a couple of other threads youve replied on (//www.diynot.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=100909 and //www.diynot.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=94536) about this sensor issue.
Is this something I could do myself? Do I need to drain the boiler?

The sensor in the boiler is an orange one and looks like has 253386 written on it. I've got a Valliant part 0020059717 Sensor water pressure which doesn't seem to correspond to part numbers mentioned.
Thanks

 

[Hack]

decided it would probably be best to get someone to do this for me however still interested if this is a straightforward job

 

[Agile]

You say your gauge is not reading anything! That sounds as if there is dirt in the system which would help to explain a few things.

In that case its quite likely that the sensor is blocked and not reading the actual pressure.

Not filling may mean that its already pressurised to the mains supply pressure. You could try depressurising and see how the sensor responds and when happens when repressurising.

I think they changed the sensor design and colour. I think that both parts are interchangeable but Dave will confirm that.

Usually they only block in the inlet tube and can usually be unblocked with a small screwdriver.

The same with the pressure gauge they usually block at the entry to the capillary tube and sometimes can be unblocked with a needle etc. but not always!

The engineers in those callout companies are paid a percentage of the labour charge so will always make it a reasonable charge otherwise its not worth their while. An independent will either be the proprieter ( best ) or a salaried employee with no benefit in taking a long time. We do most repairs on a fixed price basis so there is no advantage taking longer.

Tony

 

[gas4you]

Yes it is a straight forward job.

Isolate boiler from heating system by shutting off ch isolators underneath boiler, then drain boiler via drain offs on same valves.

Remove and replace sensor.

 

[Hack]

Thanks for the replies.

Realised why no water going in....both stop valves on the cold water and ch flow were closed (d'oh) so have filled it a little - just so it was showing 0.6. There was slight hissing coming from the expansion vessel air valve but that stopped. Switched on boiler and had heating and hot water. Pressure rose to 2.0 and just over redline on gauge (manometer?). Also drops coming out of pressure relief discharge so have switched it off again.

Re draining the system....just to double check I turn the service valves on the ch send and return and then drain off both by turning the bolt at the side and it drains out of the threaded pipe to the side of the valve?
Then just unplug the sensor electrics and pull it out? In the spares packet I have an o-ring seal, a metal 'U' wire clip and a larger metal 'U' plate. Looking at the existing sensor, I can see where the wire U clip goes but not the plate.

If the sensor has gone would the manometer also show low pressure or do you think this is a dirt issue? To try and unblock that do I just remove the metal cover on the capillary tube and unbolt at the expansion vessel end?
many thanks again.

 

[gas4you]

The sensor is only for reading the 0.2 Bar increase in pressure when the pump runs, not the general system/boiler pressure.

Low system pressure can make the fault seem worse, but is not a direct cause of F75.

 

[Hack]

well it ended that an engineer came out and replaced the sensor. He also checked over a couple of other areas inc the expansion tank and thinks there may still be a problem here. Either way the initial problem is resolved so thanks to you both very much for your help and time.

 

[Hack]

one thing i would like to ask is whether I should ask for a refund from the original callout as I don't think that the diagnosis was appropriate for the time taken and should i report the colmpany to valliant?
thanks

 

[gas4you]

When it comes to complaining, only you, as the person on the receiving end on site, can be the judge of whether to or not.

As for complaining to Vaillant, unless he/they were recommended by them, then I can see that they will probably not be interested in the slightest