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Are all TRVs made equal? Are Wolseley any good?

Discussion in 'Plumbing and Central Heating' started by DIYNotIan, 14 Feb 2019.

  1. DIYNotIan

    DIYNotIan

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    Hi again

    Got the plumber here and he's fitting plumb centre tradefix TRVs (WTRVP AK15N). Are these ok? I'm usually the kinda person who likes to spend more to get decent quality, but I don't know much about TRVs and so don't know if these are any good or not?

    Sorry for all the questions!

    Cheers
     
  2. D_Hailsham

    D_Hailsham

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    I don't know who makes them for Plumb Center, but they do seem very cheap. TRVs made by reputable companies, e.g. Danfoss, Drayton and Honeywell, are more expensive.

    If you want something better, tell the plumber. It's your house and your money.
     
  3. DIYNotIan

    DIYNotIan

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    Ok, thanks. It's hard to tell really. Some things in life it's worth spending more on. Other things not. Hand soap, toilet roll, I'm happy with cheap and think they do the job just as well as expensive. I've no idea what the potential problems would be with cheap TRVs... Poor performance, don't last long... Or is it that they are more difficult to turn and don't look as good. Just examples really and just thinking aloud. As I don't know anything about them I thought I'd ask you guys who do and who install them all the time.

    Whilst on the subject, he'll be installing a system filter of the same brand - Wolseley 609932....
     
  4. Someuser08

    Someuser08

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    One thing to consider is that if you want to upgrade them to smart trv in the future yourself, make sure their base have something like M30x1.5mm thread (which is the most common) to avoid to have replace the whole thing...
     
  5. Hot&Cold

    Hot&Cold

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    DIYNotIan,have you asked your installer ?

    Your installer will know :censored: if not there is something fishy going on :mrgreen:
     
  6. FiremanT

    FiremanT

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    Cheap TRVs stick, especially if left off, say, over the summer.
    I always fitted Draytons, 5 or 6 times the cost of cheapos. Out of hundreds upon hundreds, I can recall only one sticker.
     
  7. muggles

    muggles

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    Cheap ones tend to contain wax capsules which are slower to react. More expensive ones tend to use liquid capsules instead, and give you a more stable room temperature as a result
     
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  8. bazdaman

    bazdaman

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    The plumb center trade fix are myson contract body's. The plumb center heads look better. I believe they are made by myson. I like them and fit them regularly, also come in trv and lockshield pack now
     
  9. TECHNI

    TECHNI

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    The centre brand are rebadged myson petite trv’s
     
  10. ScottishGasMan

    ScottishGasMan

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    I preffer drayton TRV4s. as said they are pricey, are they worth it? Not directly as while I've never had trouble with them they like anything else can fail, but unlike cheap ones, they are serviceable.

    For the extra they cost Id spend more money on system protection/flushing filtering and inhibiting to reduce chances of faults all through the system.

    Don't know about the filter. looks alot like a big version of the Adey Atom.
     
  11. ericmark

    ericmark

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    My house had all Honeywell VT15's, except for one I fitted, which was an unbranded from screwfix, likely the cheapest they do, I have 4 MiHome electronic heads fitted, and the unbranded is by far the most accurate.

    OK there may be other factors, the unbranded is on radiator feed, where some of the Honeywell are fitted to the return, during the summer there is an exercise routine, so unlikely to stick.

    I am sure there is a difference between wax, liquid, bellows and electronic, however the head and the valve are different items, and if the kind of person who wants better quality, then likely the heads will be replaced for electronic heads anyway.

    I find having a head marked * to 6 it is rather hard to set at the correct temperature, far easier when marked in °C, I know the MiHome Energenie have two sensors one for air and one for water so they are quite accurate, as to the others I don't know.
     
  12. DIYNotIan

    DIYNotIan

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    Thanks for all the replies. A few answers to some of the points raised...

    - The plumber was a nice guy but communication wasn't his strong point. So we weren't able to ask too many questions.

    - We won't ever want smart TRVs or any of that jazz, so that's not a concern. I just didn't want him fitting TRVs that might be stuck out broken by next year.

    - RE TRVs sticking, esp over the summer. Can anything be done to help with this? Leave them in a certain position? Or turn them once a fortnight or something (or dodo that make no difference with the heating off)? Anything else to help them?

    - A couple of mentions of flow vs return advice... He said he had to put some of them on flow and some on the return of the rads. I guess if he had to then he had to! But a bit more info on whether that's fine or if there are downsides would be useful...

    Many thanks :)
     
  13. bazdaman

    bazdaman

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    Leave trvs open in summer and every now and then turn off and on.
    The trvs he's fit are bi directional so can be fit on flow or return
     
  14. ericmark

    ericmark

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    My wifi heads exercise the valve does not matter heating on or off, not a clue with wax, as to TRV flow or return it depends what you want the TRV to do, in my case the TRV changes the temperature three times a day, and keeps the temperature to within a deg C of the settings, to do that they really do need to be on the supply side so they start to react as soon as the hot water arrives, if fitted on return the radiator fills with hot water before it is sensed by the valve, so is more likely to over shoot, however careful adjustment of the lock shield valve can cause a delay in radiator heating which in turn gives time for the valve to adjust, it just takes a little more setting than on the supply side.

    The problem is not what the valve can do, but knowing if it's the lock shield valve that needs a tweak, or the TRV that needs a tweak, when for a time I moved out of this house and swapped the wifi valve heads back to wax it worked nearly as well as the lock shield was set correct.

    But if a room is too warm, unless you have a report target 20°C current 22°C how do you know which valve to alter? Knowing room at 22°C and valve set half way between 3 and 4 simply does not cut it.

    However the wifi is really not required, I know at around 10 pm I will be going to bed, so at 8 pm bedroom temperature goes up to 18°C and at 10 pm living room goes down to 16°C, I get up around 8 am so at 6 am the living room set to 20°C and at 9 am bedroom down to 16°C. This is very rarely altered, there is no real advantage being able to alter temperature with PC or Phone. Likely the Terrier i30 would have done the job just as well.

    As for geofencing, because the heads have anti-hysteresis software to stop them over shooting, the last 2°C is slow so set at 16°C and then moved to 20°C will hit 18°C reasonable fast, but a couple of hours before at 20°C which is rather pointless as house rarely cools to 16°C often only dropped to 18°C so unless you work 100 miles away, geofencing is pointless, times are far better.

    The ideal is to control the boiler with a modulating hub, if not that then a modulating thermostat, but if the thermostat is not a modulating type, then it's only job is to stop the boiler cycling in the summer, and you don't then want any anti hysteresis software on the thermostat, having 2°C between off and on is good, as whole idea it to stop cycling. This means wifi off/on wall thermostats are out, as either they have no fail safe, or have anti hysteresis software, so it has to be hard wired type.

    With an exception, although gas boilers modulate possibly 6kW to 28kW oil often don't modulate, and if they do more like 18kW to 24kW so unless using a heat store, if using oil then the TRV does not work anywhere near as well as with gas.

    So with gas whole idea is boiler output varies rather than it switching off/on so TRV is very important, with oil it will switch off/on anyway so TRV only stops rooms over heating, they don't control the boiler either by return water temperature or direct connection to boiler bus.
     
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