bathroom installation bodged

Turkeys - to remove the tub you could collapse the leg frame at the tap end as this may allow the tub to be tilted down at that end; the result of this is to effectively 'shorten' the bath's overall length. You may just get enough to be able to slip the beast out. Obviously you'll have to fiddle with a knife (snap-off blade type as it's flexy) to cut through the silicon. Flip the tub's direction, slip it back into position then jack the leg back up. Maybe worth a try.

Oh, just realised that it might be wise to whip off the tub's trap before you start as this'll give a bit more 'drop'.
 
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The problem with rectifying this mess is that lifting a bath requires two people, and I have no-one who would be willing to do this work with me. I cannot even lift the new toilet. And because I doubt everything they have done, I will have a complete refit. I will end up losing a lot of money, but this is a lesson learned.

Obviously I am unhappy about the shiite tiling (there are rough edges not shown), the failure to remove coving, the bath the wrong way round, the possibly bad installation of the bath, the bad cutting of tiles around the shower pipes, and there may/will be unseen issues.

These people were found via CheckATrade and they have a long list of good references. I checked up on two of them, and they seemed genuine. They were older people, and one offered to let me visit. This is the second company from CheckATrade I have dealt with. The first was so so. Not particularly bad, a genuine company employing good tradesmen, but with rough edges - such as continual 'I'll do it next day' promises that are forgotten - not mentioned in reviews. But this bathroom company are a bunch of bodgers. I cannot believe the reviews are real. I am left wondering how I can get redress, or at least have the other references checked to see if these people are fraudsters.

Anyway, always always find trades people via personal recommendations, and check multiple references.
 
never use a full bathroom fit company, split the trades up and manage it yourself.
The problem is that many "supply/fit" companies don't actually employ any trades, they only sub the work out & probably never check quality unless they get complaints. You should also ask yourself why are they on "checktrade" or any similar trade website; if they are any good at what they do, they won't need to ply for trade.

Subbing out yourself can be even more risky if you’re inexperienced at managing trades & have no real idea what’s involved. Unless you really understand what’s required & good practice in each trade, it’s a stone bonk certainty that if something goes wrong it’s always going to be someone else’s trade that screwed up & then you will have a moving target, trying to kick several asres instead of one. :LOL:

It’s very sad there seems to be so many chancers & cowboys around who really have no real idea of what they are doing & may have been working a checkout or gardening last month. True tradesmen seem to be thin on the ground but I still believe the best option is to employ someone who specialises in complete refurbishments, actually knows what they are doing & can either undertake or manage ALL the work; but then it don't come cheap & I would be biased. ;)
 
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Only read through this post quite quickly but re taking the bath out,no one has mentioned the "L" brackets that usually come with an acrylic bath which would normally be fitted up under the tiles.
Also its fairly standard practice IMO to also silicone a bath in BEFORE tiling and then again when its tiled.
So removing a bath if I had installed it would require the bottom row of tiles moving,brackets unscrewing and silicone cutting.

If you can unscrew the legs on the bath and drop it out then its not fitted properly.
 
I agree with the comment by Richard.

Yesterday I popped off a few more tiles, having given plenty of time for the adhesive to cure. They came off with almost no effort, very poor cohesion. I looked at one today, and it's clear that a) they adhesive was applied to the tile (which I believe to be wrong) and b) most of the adhesive was not in contact with the wall, only two smallish patches touched the wall. It makes me angry that these people are not even at the level of a good DIY person.

checkatrade has no gurantee of quality sadly it is just an advertising board.

never use a full bathroom fit company, split the trades up and manage it yourself.

CheckATrade does have customer reviews, and the companies cannot remove reviews, except in exceptional circumstances (such as a fraudulent review).

There are problems with managing trades myself. Firstly, I have to find good people, which is not easy. Secondly I have to take time off work. Thirdly I have to know who to hire and in which order. If I get it wrong, one might blame the other, leaving me clueless. And fourthly, some people might do a good job for a project manager who might provide regular work, but they have less incentive to do good work for a one off job. Obviously many people have a sense of pride in their work.

I have the name of someone who does it all himself, and he is good. I also had a good local builder come round, and he should give me a quote. He is more expensive as he project manages the trades, but he is good.

I have sent a letter to the cowboys demanding return of all money within 28 days under the Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982, as the work is not of acceptable quality. Even though I have some furniture which they bought (from the money I gave them), I am having to rent for longer, so I am charging them for the extra rent I pay.
 
never use a full bathroom fit company, split the trades up and manage it yourself.
The problem is that many "supply/fit" companies don't actually employ any trades, they only sub the work out & probably never check quality unless they get complaints. You should also ask yourself why are they on "checktrade" or any similar trade website; if they are any good at what they do, they won't need to ply for trade.

Subbing out yourself can be even more risky if you’re inexperienced at managing trades & have no real idea what’s involved. Unless you really understand what’s required & good practice in each trade, it’s a stone bonk certainty that if something goes wrong it’s always going to be someone else’s trade that screwed up & then you will have a moving target, trying to kick several asres instead of one. :LOL:

It’s very sad there seems to be so many chancers & cowboys around who really have no real idea of what they are doing & may have been working a checkout or gardening last month. True tradesmen seem to be thin on the ground but I still believe the best option is to employ someone who specialises in complete refurbishments, actually knows what they are doing & can either undertake or manage ALL the work; but then it don't come cheap & I would be biased. ;)

problem being with live in a country who has no idea who to fix the problem of crap trades .

simple to fix make all of them pay £1000 each to take a course and an exam in whatever they are skilled in once they pass their photo is taken and added to a government website where you can find trained people.
Then a civil servant is sent round to inspect each job for quality and signed off added to the profile of that person, failure to comply and carryout the course results in 6 months in prison and 2 year work ban.

simple.
 
never use a full bathroom fit company, split the trades up and manage it yourself.
The problem is that many "supply/fit" companies don't actually employ any trades, they only sub the work out & probably never check quality unless they get complaints. You should also ask yourself why are they on "checktrade" or any similar trade website; if they are any good at what they do, they won't need to ply for trade.

Subbing out yourself can be even more risky if you’re inexperienced at managing trades & have no real idea what’s involved. Unless you really understand what’s required & good practice in each trade, it’s a stone bonk certainty that if something goes wrong it’s always going to be someone else’s trade that screwed up & then you will have a moving target, trying to kick several asres instead of one. :LOL:

It’s very sad there seems to be so many chancers & cowboys around who really have no real idea of what they are doing & may have been working a checkout or gardening last month. True tradesmen seem to be thin on the ground but I still believe the best option is to employ someone who specialises in complete refurbishments, actually knows what they are doing & can either undertake or manage ALL the work; but then it don't come cheap & I would be biased. ;)

problem being with live in a country who has no idea who to fix the problem of crap trades .

simple to fix make all of them pay £1000 each to take a course and an exam in whatever they are skilled in once they pass their photo is taken and added to a government website where you can find trained people.
Then a civil servant is sent round to inspect each job for quality and signed off added to the profile of that person, failure to comply and carryout the course results in 6 months in prison and 2 year work ban.

simple.

I agree with your first sentence. There is nothing to stop a couple of monkeys who cannot tile, or design bathrooms, from setting up a business designing and installing bathrooms. They are probably learning on the job, though they are not learning much in the case of the two I met.

But having each job inspected would be a bureaucratic nightmare. You would need a shed load of inspectors, each trained to inspect work, and they would need paying, so the customer would end up paying, increasing costs. Would they inspect all jobs? A replacement tap? A replacement sink? A new bathroom?

I think as you say there should be courses, and to tile you'd need to pass the tiling course. At its simplest you tile a wall, and get a pass if it meets basic standards. And you attend classes first if need be. And to install bathrooms you need a set of basic skills. To do plumbing work you need to pass a plumbing course.

But what about painting and decorating? Does the course test for neatness? For straightness of lines when cutting in?

The chap who installed my kitchen was a methodical careful worker who did a first rate job. But someone could pass a kitchen installation course and not be a grade 1 worker. Or perhaps they would become a grade one worker after fitting 10 or so kitchens. It's hard to test that.

I think at the end of the day the customer needs to be very careful about vetting a trades person, and assume they are crap until proven otherwise i.e. personal recommendation.
 
never use a full bathroom fit company, split the trades up and manage it yourself.
The problem is that many "supply/fit" companies don't actually employ any trades, they only sub the work out & probably never check quality unless they get complaints. You should also ask yourself why are they on "checktrade" or any similar trade website; if they are any good at what they do, they won't need to ply for trade.

Subbing out yourself can be even more risky if you’re inexperienced at managing trades & have no real idea what’s involved. Unless you really understand what’s required & good practice in each trade, it’s a stone bonk certainty that if something goes wrong it’s always going to be someone else’s trade that screwed up & then you will have a moving target, trying to kick several asres instead of one. :LOL:

It’s very sad there seems to be so many chancers & cowboys around who really have no real idea of what they are doing & may have been working a checkout or gardening last month. True tradesmen seem to be thin on the ground but I still believe the best option is to employ someone who specialises in complete refurbishments, actually knows what they are doing & can either undertake or manage ALL the work; but then it don't come cheap & I would be biased. ;)

problem being with live in a country who has no idea who to fix the problem of crap trades .

simple to fix make all of them pay £1000 each to take a course and an exam in whatever they are skilled in once they pass their photo is taken and added to a government website where you can find trained people.
Then a civil servant is sent round to inspect each job for quality and signed off added to the profile of that person, failure to comply and carryout the course results in 6 months in prison and 2 year work ban.

simple.

I agree with your first sentence. There is nothing to stop a couple of monkeys who cannot tile, or design bathrooms, from setting up a business designing and installing bathrooms. They are probably learning on the job, though they are not learning much in the case of the two I met.

But having each job inspected would be a bureaucratic nightmare. You would need a shed load of inspectors, each trained to inspect work, and they would need paying, so the customer would end up paying, increasing costs. Would they inspect all jobs? A replacement tap? A replacement sink? A new bathroom?

I think as you say there should be courses, and to tile you'd need to pass the tiling course. At its simplest you tile a wall, and get a pass if it meets basic standards. And you attend classes first if need be. And to install bathrooms you need a set of basic skills. To do plumbing work you need to pass a plumbing course.

But what about painting and decorating? Does the course test for neatness? For straightness of lines when cutting in?

The chap who installed my kitchen was a methodical careful worker who did a first rate job. But someone could pass a kitchen installation course and not be a grade 1 worker. Or perhaps they would become a grade one worker after fitting 10 or so kitchens. It's hard to test that.

I think at the end of the day the customer needs to be very careful about vetting a trades person, and assume they are crap until proven otherwise i.e. personal recommendation.

yes depending on the nature of the work ie extensive i do think it should be inspected, only way to gauge quality no offence but my granny with bad eye sight may think the work completed was to a high standard when in actual fact it was crap. so i would not go by a personal recommendation.

but you are right, assume they are crap until proven different, most are anyway.
 
no offence but my granny with bad eye sight may think the work completed was to a high standard when in actual fact it was crap. so i would not go by a personal recommendation.

but you are right, assume they are crap until proven different, most are anyway.

No offence taken, and you are right, you have to know the person in order to know if their recommendation is worth anything. Some people have low standards, some are fussy.

Regarding "most are anyway", I hired a builder, and most work seems good, but he filled screw holes in skirting board with caulk - :rolleyes: - and bodged putting self levelling compound on the kitchen floor - :rolleyes: - and seeing that sort of cock up tells me that I should do as much as I can myself. I've repaired the floor. I've put up coving in three rooms (a good job), almost finished painting all of the walls in my house (and they look very good), I've started painting the wood work (a wobbly start, but getting the hang of oil based paint), and then I will hang some new doors.

To be honest I think an average person who is careful and methodical can do most work themselves. Unfortunately I'm not prepared to spend the time to learn to do a bathroom, although many colleagues do their own kitchens and bathrooms.
 
no offence but my granny with bad eye sight may think the work completed was to a high standard when in actual fact it was crap. so i would not go by a personal recommendation.

but you are right, assume they are crap until proven different, most are anyway.

No offence taken, and you are right, you have to know the person in order to know if their recommendation is worth anything. Some people have low standards, some are fussy.

Regarding "most are anyway", I hired a builder, and most work seems good, but he filled screw holes in skirting board with caulk - :rolleyes: - and bodged putting self levelling compound on the kitchen floor - :rolleyes: - and seeing that sort of cock up tells me that I should do as much as I can myself. I've repaired the floor. I've put up coving in three rooms (a good job), almost finished painting all of the walls in my house (and they look very good), I've started painting the wood work (a wobbly start, but getting the hang of oil based paint), and then I will hang some new doors.

To be honest I think an average person who is careful and methodical can do most work themselves. Unfortunately I'm not prepared to spend the time to learn to do a bathroom, although many colleagues do their own kitchens and bathrooms.

exactly it`s your home and you will take the time an care to do it
unfortunatly we live in a society with no morals or self pride in work.
i find they just want your money and quickly to hell with everything else.

correct do as much as you can yourself, i just fitted the cloakroom at home myself to correct a bodge up the first time by a crappy tiler
i cleared the lot out replastered walls tiled the floor with nice quartz tiles and fitted new suite for £550 all in.
 

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