Building a rather large wall by side of the road

[KayCee14]

Hi folks,

I am concerned about a rather large brick wall that a resident has put up (he moved in in Summer). I have attached photos of what it looked like previously and what it looks like now. You will notice there is a bus stop which serves a number of schools and many people with kids wait there. Not to mention the walkway on the side of the house. If we ever had a storm like Arwen, and that wall collapsed, anyone below that brickwork would not survive. I am certain this build is illegal and that is probably why the previous owners never did anything this stupid. I would appreciate your help. I have been on hold to the council for 1 hour and no answer. I'd like that wall removed before it collapses on a member of the public and we are left with a fatality that could have been avoided.

This is the location on Google maps: https://goo.gl/maps/q24DBUpbrQ3iZsi16

 

[KayCee14]

Further to this, I doubt they go approval from the council and highly unlikely the council would have approved such a dangerous build.

 

[John D v2.0]

When you say approval do you mean they haven't got planning permission?
Because it looks awful in my opinion and would almost certainly need planning permission depending what the levels on the other side, but in terms of being a dangerous structure it's hard to tell just by looking. Many walls are built higher so the height is not the only consideration for safety.
Hope you get the result you're happy with.

 

[noseall]

Wow, that's some monster. Myself and the customer had to jump through hoops to get this wall approved....

Bigwall8

• noseall
• 27 Jun 2021

Bigwall6

• noseall
• 27 Jun 2021

Bigwall4

• noseall
• 27 Jun 2021

Bigwall3

• noseall
• 27 Jun 2021

Bigwall2

• noseall
• 27 Jun 2021

Bigwall1

• noseall
• 27 Jun 2021

...it went to neighbour consultation and was only approved after some discussion and deviation from the original design.

It would be interesting to see how an SE would view that fortress.

 

[KayCee14]

I think your wall is fine, albeit long doesn't pose a risk to people below (Unless they are midgets). And also the structure that the wall is built on (as per my post) isnt exactly a straight run line, it's jagged and probably dates back over 100 years. It does look like a monstrosity, however my concern is purely around the safety of it and the height at which those bricks could fall onto the passing public. Who would I need to speak to to report this however, is it the council, who are useless by the way.

 

[Old Salt]

If your on hold for an hour just bypass them and inform your local councillor or newspaper.

 

[^woody^]

How do you know it's dangerous and a risk to people? Are you an engineer? It actually looks well built despite the aesthetics.

Anyway you need to make your complaint to the planning department at your council

 

[jacko555]

How tall is it, measured from the ground level on their side?
Won't it be permitted development if its <=1m?

 

[bernardgreen]

My concern would be wind loading on the wall. Built that close to the corner of a house there is likely to be turbulent wind flow between house and wall. Turbulent flow can be far more damaging than plain laminal flow.

 

[mattylad]

Has your council got a planning portal where they show all the planning applications?
Have a look see.

 

[mikeey84]

My concern would be wind loading on the wall. Built that close to the corner of a house there is likely to be turbulent wind flow between house and wall. Turbulent flow can be far more damaging than plain laminal flow.

Are curved walls not a lot stronger than straight?

Sure I saw a single leaf wall built with waves in it and they didn't need piers or another leaf?

 

[bernardgreen]

Are curved walls not a lot stronger than straight?

If the curve is in the right direction then a curved wall, such as the wall of a dam, will resist far greater pressures than it could if it were built as a straight wall between the two anchor points.

\What ever that wall is retaining, be it land or wind, the pressure will be on the inside of the curve and thus the curve will add only a small amount of resistance to toppling

 

[RonnyRaygun]

It would be interesting to see how an SE would view that fortress.

OK

Well, obviously we can see that the house is considerably higher than the street, and if you look at the snapshot below, we can see from the steps that ground level directly outside the house is somewhere near the top of the wall.

Looking at the wall between the steps and the front garden, this would imply that garden level nearest to the wall in question is pretty much at (former) top of wall level (probably a couple of hundred millimetres down, I'd guess).

So the wall is a retaining wall and is already retaining a good couple of metres of soil and potential surcharge load.

There are a few issues in that respect with building another 1.5m or so of wall on top of it (and potentially it looks like they might be thinking about some timber panelling between the pillars, which would raise the new structure to 1.8m above existing).
That's quite a lot of wind load on a 9" wall, but they have, at least, also put in some 215x330mm piers, which do help stiffen the structure, as does the curve.
Anyway, making a few assumptions with regard to the wind load (shouldn't be too high in South East London) and flexural strength, I reckon the new portion of the wall, at least, is probably OK.

The other question is the affect the additional dead load and wind load is having on the existing retaining wall. We don't know if the wall is masonry or concrete, gravity, or reinforced. Assuming that the wall has no toe (as it would have to protrude into highways owned land) then any additional dead load will be over the heel (but closer to the front of it). Are the new piers built off the existing wall (assuming it is 330mm thick, or it thickens to 330mm not too far down)? You would hope they are built off the wall itself, but we don't know. Either way, the additional dead load will add forces that will likely contribute to overturning, bearing, and sliding forces, as will the additional wind load.

Definitely a wall that should have had SE input, with trial pits to check the existing wall structure and a design carried out to determine capacity with regard to the additional loads created.

Obviously, none of us know if that is the case. Those are my thoughts anyway...

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

The concrete section is a retaining wall, for the garden soil and looks original. That was originally surmounted by a growth of hedge, there are no planning rules on hedges. Having removed the hedge they have topped it with a brick wall and such need PP if they are greater than 1m high where they adjoin a road - that monstrosity would certainly need PP. Complain to your councillor and/or the papers.

 

[johnny2007]

A few moons ago our neighbour tried something similar and the council stopped them because being in a corner they couldn't go higher than 4 foot or so.
Thanks god because they were going to build an 8 foot concrete block monstrosity.
The ended up with a standard 4 fence.