CALLING ALL EXPERTS

[securespark]

FWIW, I doubt that Hotpoint would have a leg to stand on if it decided to complain that the installation was not in accordance with their instructions, PROVIDED IT MET THE REQUIREMENTS OF BS7671:2008.

 

[EFLImpudence]

We're always quoting regarding the M.I.s but all 510.2 states is:

"...shall take account of manufacturers' instructions."

Is there a more forceful regulation anywhere?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

.
I thought it had been decided to use a 32A breaker.

No.

Why change it?

The 40A circuit will be fine.

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

We're always quoting regarding the M.I.s but all 510.2 states is:

"...shall take account of manufacturers' instructions."

Is there a more forceful regulation anywhere?

510.2
Every item of equipment shall be selected and erected so as to allow compliance with the regulations stated in other parts of BS7671 and shall take account of manufacturers instructions.

So that to me, means we should follow MIs
This is the installers responsiubilty, if something goes wrong who do you think will be held accountable?
But I am playing devils advocate, as I see nothing unsafe with using a 40A device on the circuit providing a cable that can carry that current safely within the route it takes and de-rating factors have been calculated in to the design.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

We're always quoting regarding the M.I.s but all 510.2 states is:

"...shall take account of manufacturers' instructions."

Is there a more forceful regulation anywhere?

134.1

.... Electrical equipment shall be installed in accordance with the instructions provided by the manufacturer of the equipment.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

So that to me, means we should follow MIs.

Then you're reading it wrongly - confirmed by you emphasising the wrong word.

Try
Every item of equipment shall be selected and erected so as to allow compliance with the regulations stated in other parts of BS7671 and shall take account of manufacturers instructions.

"Take account of" does not mean "blindly follow no matter what". (At least, it doesn't in the UK. In other parts of the world, e.g. the Wallis & Fortuna Islands I believe it does.)

510.2 subordinates the following of MIs to compliance with the Regulations.

 

[EFLImpudence]

134.1

Ah! Thanks.

I thought there was a more direct instruction somewhere but couldn't find it.

 

[sparkattack]

Well cooker arrived today and hardwired with the 6mm cable and the existing 40amp couldn't be happier.

The £60 saved will go towards the bairns christmases a big thanks to all involved from myself,missus and the kids.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Good to know ban-all-sheds

Not a fan of B&Q i take it

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

So that to me, means we should follow MIs.

Then you're reading it wrongly - confirmed by you emphasising the wrong word.

Try
Every item of equipment shall be selected and erected so as to allow compliance with the regulations stated in other parts of BS7671 and shall take account of manufacturers instructions.

"Take account of" does not mean "blindly follow no matter what". (At least, it doesn't in the UK. In other parts of the world, e.g. the Wallis & Fortuna Islands I believe it does.)

510.2 subordinates the following of MIs to compliance with the Regulations.

Don't have firking clue what you mean by this post? Likely the highlighting of the whole "shall take account" would be better, but don't see any difference.
All I will add is if the cooker blows up, catches fire, burns house down, burns neighbours house down, injurys/kills peolpe and the MI was not followed. Hotpoint want be holding their hand up when it comes to the insurances claims and involuntary manslaughter charges?
And I would also think the IEE would be quoting regulations 510.2 and 134.1 in court.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

All I will add is if the cooker blows up, catches fire, burns house down, burns neighbours house down, injurys/kills peolpe and the MI was not followed. Hotpoint want be holding their hand up when it comes to the insurances claims and involuntary manslaughter charges?
And I would also think the IEE would be quoting regulations 510.2 and 134.1 in court.

I suppose that Hotpoint and the IEE are welcome to try and show that it happened because the cooker was on a B40 rather than a B45.

But you might find yourself rearranging these words:

witness

mincemeat

of

expert

making

their.

 

[EFLImpudence]

I will just repeat that -

the instructions from the sales company state it should have a 45A fuse.
(In view of the following that is clearly wrong)

Whereas -

the actual manufacturer's instructions from Hotpoint state that it should be supplied through a minimum 32A control switch and 6mm² cable.
(Correctly leaving the final details to the electrician).

So, all is well.

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

But you might find yourself rearranging these words:

witness

mincemeat

of

expert

making

their.

I would prefer rather to rearranging these words:

Followed

I

Instruction

Manufacturers.

Therefore:

Covered

Arse

My

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

I will just repeat that -

the instructions from the sales company state it should have a 45A fuse.
(In view of the following that is clearly wrong)

Whereas -

the actual manufacturer's instructions from Hotpoint state that it should be supplied through a minimum 32A control switch and 6mm² cable.
(Correctly leaving the final details to the electrician).

So, all is well.

EFLI your correct and it's not under dispute by me, the point I am making is that MIs should be followed. It states that in BS7671 and most electrical (well I hope it is all) is designed and tested in away, that the MI, gives you informed instruction on the way the appliance should be installed so it functions safely.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Yes, I don't think I have disagreed with you.

134.1

.... Electrical equipment shall be installed in accordance with the instructions provided by the manufacturer of the equipment.

A bit more than 'take account of'.