Car charger query

[BigJon]

Hi, I was looking for some advice regarding a mates EV charger that he had installed through a scheme when he bought the car.
He called me to loosen the charger off the wall so he could sort the roughcasting that the installer had burst whilst drilling through the wall.
Install seems shoddy, wall burst, no clips inside, cable clamp missing in charger, no test certs but my attention was drawn to the earth connection in the charger.

It has 2 earth connections, TT/TN-S and PME, he has connected into the TT side when it is a PME system that my mate has.
I called the installer to double check it was correct, he seemed unsure and that he only ever connects to TT and said to leave it.

I'm not familiar with car chargers, I thought they needed an earth rod but not sure if the technology has moved on over the years.

Should the earth connection be in the PME side?
It's an Easeeone charger that has been fitted, I've included a picture from the manual and the charger itself.

Thanks.

Thanks
John

 

[Risteard]

To be fair their instructions don't make sense.

They have "L1", "N" & "PEN" listed as connections in their TN-C-S drawing. You won't have a PEN conductor at this point. The PEN conductor in a TN-C-S installation is simply at the origin - it is the TN-C (Combined) part of the equation, with the -S (Separate) from that point on. The fact they have listed PEN and N as two separate conductors is nonsensical. A PEN is a protective Earthed neutral - i.e. combined Neutral & Earth connection.

We also don't know what type of devices are fitted upstream, e.g. there might be PEN fault detection upstream.

 

[ericmark]

With a TN-C-S supply there are three options.

1) If the is enough separation convert to TT supply.
2) Use an earth electrode as a reference point to detect loss of PEN
3) Use the incoming voltage to detect loss of PEN.
For some reason it seems allowed 70 volt between earths on a EV charger, everything else is 50 volt, not a clue why, but it senses voltage and if not in the 207 to 253 volt range it fully disconnects the charger first lives then earth.

I looked for internet instructions and could only find U-Tube videos, so not a clue which method it uses. All I could find was a single/three phase unit which is not as you show. It would seem only option would be to call the manufacturers help line.

no test certs

Not sure of law in Scotland, I know here is Wales an outside installation like this would need registering under Part P, so one would get two bits of paperwork, the installation certificate and either a compliance certificate if scheme member fits it, or a completion certificate if non scheme member fits it.

See what others say.

 

[flameport]

I thought they needed an earth rod

Some do, most don't, some have options for them.

The Easee has one of the protection methods as described in BS7671, so can be installed without an earth rod.
However that only works if it's connected according to the 'TN-C-S' diagram, which it hasn't.
It's installed incorrectly.

no test certs

Should have been provided, and should have been notified to the DNO as well.

What is the rest of the installation like - cable type, where is the cable installed, what is it connected to in the consumer unit ?

 

[BigJon]

Thanks everyone for your replies.
The charger is wired in 6mm T&E, it's back to back with consumer unit so the cable is 2m max.
It's connected to a 32A MCB, the main Switch is 30ma.
Looking into EV chargers online it seems they may have to have a type B RCD (again I may be wrong) so I'm not sure if the main RCD will comply?

Thanks

 

[flameport]

That is a type AC RCD, not appropriate for supplying any EV. Type A minimum if a RCD is required, which it probably wasn't in that installation.
Not appropriate to add another circuit to an RCD that already supplies so many other circuits either.
The Easee includes the equivalent of a Type B, however those can't be installed downstream of a Type AC.

Ultimately it's been slung in by someone who either doesn't care, doesn't know that they are doing, or both.

 

[ericmark]

This is my worry, if an EV is being charged where there is no access to the public, then up to who ever owns the property what they do, it may not comply with regulations or law, but only person it is going to hurt is them, suicide is no longer illegal.

But where the public does have access, be it postman, milkman, or any other caller, then it must be safe for those callers.

So I charge my EV's in doors with a TN-C-S supply and type AC RCBO's, and I am not really worried as one EV is 36 volt the other 48 volt and both chargers are class II. (I have 2 e-bikes)

Why cars are not class II I have never worked out, they are it seems class I, so require an earth when on charge, they can under fault conditions allow DC to flow, so need either a type B RCD or a 6 mA detection unit which will auto disconnect under fault conditions, the latter allows the use of type A RCD's, and under fault conditions a TN-C-S supply earth can raise above 50 volt from true earth so if being charged outside it needs some method to auto disconnect the earth (after first disconnecting supply) should there be a fault.

In real terms loss of PEN is not that common, so a installation which is connected incorrectly could run for 50 years without there being a problem, it could also happen latter today of course. The milkman across to road to me in my old house showed me his installation, it was for the phase 1 Renault Kango long wheel base electric van. Type 1 socket. There was simply a new MCB fitted in his consumer unit back in around 2011 when we were still using 17th edition wiring in 2013 it changed to type 2 socket, max charge rate on both was limited to 16 amp. They had a 110 mile range and in real terms he he did not always get the 64 miles of his round, so there is a high chance at some point he will upgrade.

It is possible that the Renault Kango is class II, I don't know, but the problem is many cars or vans can plug into the same charging point, so it does not matter what the car is, the charge point has to be safe with all cars that can use it. New Renault Kango used 32 amp charge point, no DC option. But can have a hydrogen pack so can charge when running.

But since 2011 the Kango has changed, and I am sure many other EV's have also changed, so have the rules for fitting charge points, but as far as I am aware there is nothing to say older charge points must be upgraded, and this worries me, we have charge points that once fitted may be used for 20 years without anyone checking what was done when they were fitted.

As far as Part P goes, I mislaid the paperwork for mothers house, and the council said would take 4 months to get replacement and did not know cost, so no one is going to check if work was registered unless a death, already seen one guy trip over a charge lead on a public charge point, which could also damage the lead.