Ceiling help!

[Martin Greenhill]

Hi guys,
So im by no means skilled at this...but we all have to start somewhere. To basically theres a room in the property i have brought which has holes in the ceiling. It looks like electric cables have been traced though, Only problem is a few of the cables have been run under the joist so if i cant just replace the drywall (as the cables prevent it sitting flush), i will either need to attach new drywall over the current or remove the current dry wall and maybe attach a few bits of wood to "lower the ceiling" so the cables no longer are in the way.......Thoughts on this?

P.S. Removing the cables is not an option for this.

 

[London Mike 49]

I'm not a electrician but the options as I see it are;

1. Cut a small notch in the joist......a bit dangerous if a screw goes through it accidentally.
2. Cut cable, drill hole in joist , re connect using a suitable connector.......may need to ask advice from someone knowledgeable.
3. Cut cable and run above joist even if you have to add a bit of cable and a suitable connector.

Mike

 

[Mr Cat]

I'm in agreement with Mike,
I'd suggest cutting the cables and drilling cable holes a suitable safe distance into the joists to avoid being caught by any fixing screws. You can buy cable junction boxes very cheaply you can attach to the joists, these should be fireproof to a degree and much safer than your average chocolate block. You can also buy chocolate block that comes in a fire retardant box for exactly the purpose you want.
Just remember to make sure there's enough play in the cable to be able to rejoin it once cut, or you'll have to add in an extra bit of cable, meaning extra joins.

If you go with option 1, cutting notches into the joists just make sure you have very clear markings of where the cables are, in such places that will still be visible once all your new boards are up and ready to be fastened!

Good luck!

 

[EFLImpudence]

Notching the underside of joists is not allowed.

 

[Mr Cat]

Notching the underside of joists is not allowed.

Quite right, depending on who's watching haha. But yes a big no-no.

 

[Iggifer]

It doesn't matter who's watching. You shouldn't do it because it's dangerous, not just because it's against the rules.

 

[John D v2.0]

Well to be fair in this situation there are two reasons why not. One is it's not a prescribed way of modifying a standard joist, and two it's not going to be 50mm deep and the cables probably won't be in a prescribed zone.
The structural issue may be fine if you could do calculations cheaply enough to justify, but the depth would need over boarding anyway.

To be helpful, I think drill in a appropriate location, replace the cables and fill. Failing that 50mm batten to drop the ceiling and reboard that, which would be overkill and costly but allowable.

 

[EFLImpudence]

I think there is only one reason; that is it will weaken the joist.
It's unlikely these days that the joists will be larger than necessary.

If you are willing to overboard, then you don't need battens, just knock away the existing board where the cable is making it lower than it should be and overboard; remembering not to screw through the cable.
If the existing board is thick enough, clip the cable to the joist and fill the holes.

Otherwise it's up stairs and lift the floor boards and rerun the cables.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

and two it's not going to be 50mm deep and the cables probably won't be in a prescribed zone.

They don't have to be, and there are no ceiling zones.

 

[Mr Cat]

It is dangrous, but sometimes a man has to do what a man has to do. Listen to these people. They talk sense... I wouldn't want to screw you or a lecky cable, both of those are a certainy. Undermining the stregth of your joists is a given, given your situation you have no other option, so consider what's above? Are we talking another level or...either way to be honest it's not that big a deal. No pannic. Unless you're gonna notch and drill every single one of those beats.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

¿Que?

 

[John D v2.0]

They don't have to be, and there are no ceiling zones.

Well, true he could put steel plates in front if he didn't want to make them 50mm deep, but that's not a useful solution here. And that there are no ceiling zones means it's not in the zones!

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Well, true he could put steel plates in front if he didn't want to make them 50mm deep, but that's not a useful solution here.

Nor is it required. There are no depth requirements in ceilings.

And that there are no ceiling zones means it's not in the zones!

There are no requirements for it to be.

 

[sparkwright]

You say removing the cables is not an option.

Because, if you are removing the old ceiling, the best way is to disconnect the cables and drill holes through the joists and thread the cables through. This way you shouldn't nail or screw through the cables.

Other not so good bodges include;
a) Cutting holes in the board where the cable is, then filling later. Bodge.
b) Fitting battens or slithers of plasterboard between bottom of joists and new board. And avoid screwing through cable. Not as bad bodge.
c) Overboarding the old ceiling - don't screw through those cables. Similar bodge to above.

You know all this anyway, it's all been mentioned, but there's no substitute for moving the cables if you wan't it doing properly.

 

[Martin Greenhill]

Hi, So i cant pull the cables back through as 1 has been nicely cemented into the wall it comes out at (for the shower) I dont really want to cut the cables because im not an electrician. I dont do a notch in the joists because its 2 thick shower cables so would be a big notch so im looking more at over boarding or lowering the ceiling slighty and any advise on that.