Ceiling light wiring mess

[Edd99]

Good morning all.

We've recently had our hallway and ceiling plastered and naturally had to remove the ceiling light. Everything came away OK but i uncovered a bit of a mess.

We wanted to replace the existing fittings with some new lights but because of the mess of wires that we have, i cannot fit the new light fitting. We have 3 T&E poking out of the ceiling and a bunch of terminal blocks for the loop, earth and switched live. The combination of wires and terminal blocks are constantly fighting with the light fitting so i'm at a bit of a loss.

Any advice would be much appreciated. Thanks in advance.

 

[omega015]

I see 4 T&E Not the worst arrangement I've seen though. If you new fitting doesn't have space to wire in multiple wires and therefore removing the need for the connector blocks, then try and tidy up the wiring so that you can gently flatten the connectors to the ceiling so that the new fitting fits over them or even better see if you can push them all above the plaster. Replacing the connector blocks with something like wago connectors might make a neater job and help with space. If not just make sure the connector block terminals are tight and no exposed cores (e.g. that neutral one). And assuming that single black is the switched live, add some brown tape to it.

 

[Taylortwocities]

What you have there is a little like the description in the WIKI
//www.diynot.com/wiki/Electrics:Lighting-Rose

Although you have an additional cable, which may be providing power to something else, may be another light, or a smoke alarm perhaps.

From the wiring in your photo, the single black with the tape on should be the switched live to the light, the two blacks in the connector block will be the neutral to the light.


Have a look at the WIKI, especially the lighting section, it will help you understand that what you have is not really a mess at all - merely a lack of understanding on your part

 

[Edd99]

My bad, it is 4.

Would consolidating all of the existing wires into a single terminal block be acceptable and then take single L/E/N wires off this terminal block to the light fitting?

 

[omega015]

Yes you can use a single connector block (with separate terminals as per the diagram) instead of having them all separate (as they are now), however this might make it more difficult depending on how much space you have in the light fitting/ceiling hole.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Does that replicate how the conductors are connected now? Are all the blacks currently connected together?

 

[Taylortwocities]

Methinks EDd has miscoloured the switched live conductor. It's not red in the original photo.…

 

[Edd99]

Yeah, the switched live in the photo is black (and should have some brown tape on). I coloured it red in the drawing by mistake.

Anywho, i decided to take a peak under the carpet upstairs and hey Presto, the boards have been up for previous work and were only screwed down. I now have great access to install a junction box and tidy everything up rather than mess around trying to tuck cables back up.

Can anyone recommend a junction box that will take 4 inputs and 1 output? Thanks.

 

[EFLImpudence]

These - if you consider the location "accessible for inspection"
There is room for four cables on the left but only three terminals but you can get two wires in each terminal.
https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/ASJ501.html

or if not "accessible for inspection" these which have four x four terminal blocks-
they are push-in terminals for solid cores, with a button to press to open for stranded wires - read the instructions.
https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/ASJ804.html

 

[Echo the husky]

What light are you fitting?

 

[Edd99]

These - if you consider the location "accessible for inspection"
There is room for four cables on the left but only three terminals but you can get two wires in each terminal.
https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/ASJ501.html

or if not "accessible for inspection" these which have four x four terminal blocks-
they are push-in terminals for solid cores, with a button to press to open for stranded wires - read the instructions.
https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/ASJ804.html

Thanks buddy. I'll probably go for the J804 maintenance free since i don't really regard the location "accessible" without having to rip up carpets and floorboards again. I'll need four cables entering and one exiting (for the light itself). I trust it's ok to double up on the entry ports?

 

[Taylortwocities]

I trust it's ok to double up on the entry ports?

Yes.

 

[Edd99]

Ok, i think i have got my plan together. See attached.

Just as an aside, i like the look of the Wago stuff. Can anyone recommend i.e MF rated?

As per my drawing, i could easily buy a 1 x 2 way, 2 x 4 way and 1 x 5 way Wagos and a wagobox making everything nice and tidy and easy to fit too.

Also just like to thank everyone for their contributions. This is a really top forum.

 

[Taylortwocities]

Wago connectors plus a Wagobox = an MF solution.

You'll need the larger Wagobox for that lot!

Or use a Hager J804 junction box.

 

[Edd99]

Wago connectors plus a Wagobox = an MF solution.

You'll need the larger Wagobox for that lot!

Or use a Hager J804 junction box.

I've seen the Hager box but i like the Wago stuff personally as i have experience using it in industrial applications.

I haven't seen a bigger Wago box however. Any links?