Charlie Kirk

[Si_]

Make your mind up.

At this point I must assume you're trolling. There's no way you can can fail to understand what I painstakingly explained at least five separate times yet still retain the intellectual capacity to write words.

 

[Si_]

I've probably travelled more than most, very well aware of border controls and visas.

Seem to be more awrae of the fuller picture than you are

Then you know that the purpose of border control has nothing whatsoever to do with intimidating, punishing, or restricting the speech of foreign nationals. It is about whether that country thinks your presence would be against the public good. Homeland Security, no doubt instructed by Trump, thinks that people who celebrate Kirk's death are unpleasant people who meet that criterion. I agree with them that they are filth, but on the other hand the US is full of such people so banning them from the country is an overreach. Stop clutching your pearls about your 'free speech' being infringed by Trump, because there are far more serious and clear threats to your speech right here in the UK.

 

[carmanmemoranda]

Then you know that the purpose of border control has nothing whatsoever to do with intimidating, punishing, or restricting the speech of foreign nationals. It is about whether that country thinks your presence would be against the public good. Homeland Security, no doubt instructed by Trump, thinks that people who celebrate Kirk's death are unpleasant people who meet that criterion. I agree with them that they are filth, but on the other hand the US is full of such people so banning them from the country is an overreach. Stop clutching your pearls about your 'free speech' being infringed by Trump, because there are far more serious and clear threats to your speech right here in the UK.

Yes, Trump supporters from the USA commenting about free speech over here.

Direct involvement

 

[denso13]

At this point I must assume you're trolling. There's no way you can can fail to understand what I painstakingly explained at least five separate times yet still retain the intellectual capacity to write words.

Nonsense, you are simply wrong and have already agreed Trump is trying to stifle free speech outside of the USA.

Ad hom noted.

 

[Si_]

Nonsense, you are simply wrong and have already agreed Trump is trying to stifle free speech outside of the USA.

No, I said the opposite. "Trump is of course trying to stifle free speech. But there is no possible mechanism for him to stifle the free speech of a UK citizen in the UK without the UK government being complicit. "

 

[Si_]

Yes, Trump supporters from the USA commenting about free speech over here.

Direct involvement

So Trump supporters commenting on UK free speech is a serious threat to your free speech.

OK, we'll just leave it there.

 

[denso13]

No, I said the opposite. "Trump is of course trying to stifle free speech. But there is no possible mechanism for him to stifle the free speech of a UK citizen in the UK without the UK government being complicit. "

I know what you said, you keep saying it and it's still wrong.

Trump has already tried to stifle free speech in this country, and probably has, with no help from the UK government. If you say the wrong thing then you will not be allowed to enter the US. If you toe the line then you will.

 

[Odds]

I know what you said, you keep saying it and it's still wrong.

Trump has already tried to stifle free speech in this country, and probably has, with no help from the UK government. If you say the wrong thing then you will not be allowed to enter the US. If you toe the line then you will.

It's gonna be a heap of fun when the Orange Oaf arrives next week for another state visit, eh?

 

[Si_]

I know what you said, you keep saying it and it's still wrong.

Trump has already tried to stifle free speech in this country, and probably has, with no help from the UK government. If you say the wrong thing then you will not be allowed to enter the US. If you toe the line then you will.

As I've explained exhaustively, entry barring is based solely on whether the country in question thinks your presence will be, or will not be, in the public good. Why on earth would Trump care about the opinions of some nomark ex-councillor in a foreign country 3000 miles away? He doesn't want her in the US, sure, but it's absurd to claim he cares about what she says online. You could fill a million libraries with all the anti-Trump stuff posted by people in the UK on a daily basis.

If you claim Trump is trying to silence foreign nationals' free speech, then you must accept that every other country's leader is trying to do the same, because their countries all have similar, and normally far more stringent, policies.

That's why you never addressed my Kim Jong Un analogy. Because it's so ridiculous. Yet because it's Trump (argh! Trump!) we're expected to believe it's really happening, and that he's actually regulating what you, a foreign citizen, can and can't say. It's absurd.

 

[Notch7]

What an incisive argument. You'll have to give me time to consider my response because to be honest, you've taken me off guard with your quite brilliant intellectual parry.

It’s hilarious you think Trump is not silencing anybody

Trump's Attacks on Press Freedom Escalate: NPR, PBS Funding Cuts Explained​

From funding cuts and executive orders to billion-dollar lawsuits, the Trump administration is mounting a historic assault on independent journalism and press freedom.

Trump's Attacks on Press Freedom Escalate: NPR, PBS Funding Cuts Explained | ACLU

From funding cuts and executive orders to billion-dollar lawsuits, the Trump administration is mounting a historic assault on independent journalism and press freedom.

www.aclu.org

 

[Notch7]

If you claim Trump is trying to silence foreign nationals' free speech, then you must accept that every other country's leader is trying to do the same, because their countries all have similar, and normally far more stringent, policies

No they don’t.

 

[denso13]

I've explained exhaustively, entry barring is based solely on whether the country in question thinks your presence will be, or will not be, in the public good. Why on earth would Trump care about the opinions of some nomark ex-councillor in a foreign country 3000 miles away? He doesn't want her in the US, sure, but it's absurd to claim he cares about what she says online. You could fill a million libraries with all the anti-Trump stuff posted by people in the UK on a daily basis.

And I've explained why you are wrong. Trump says you won't be allowed in if you say nasty things about Kirk. That isn't protecting America at all because his own citizens can say it if they like, while protected by their constitution. It's trying to curb free speech, nothing more.

If you claim Trump is trying to silence foreign nationals' free speech, then you must accept that every other country's leader is trying to do the same, because their countries all have similar, and normally far more stringent, policies.

What has Starmer, for instance, ever claimed that Americans are not allowed to say in the UK? Be specific.

That's why you never addressed my Kim Jong Un analogy. Because it's so ridiculous. Yet because it's Trump (argh! Trump!) we're expected to believe it's really happening, and that he's actually regulating what you, a foreign citizen, can and can't say. It's absurd.

Same thing, he is trying to stop criticism of North Korea. Trouble is, not many outsiders want to visit so ignore the consequences. That is different to the Trump situation, if you might visit in the future then you need to do what you're told.

 

[Si_]

It’s hilarious you think Trump is not silencing anybody

Trump's Attacks on Press Freedom Escalate: NPR, PBS Funding Cuts Explained​

From funding cuts and executive orders to billion-dollar lawsuits, the Trump administration is mounting a historic assault on independent journalism and press freedom.

Trump's Attacks on Press Freedom Escalate: NPR, PBS Funding Cuts Explained | ACLU

From funding cuts and executive orders to billion-dollar lawsuits, the Trump administration is mounting a historic assault on independent journalism and press freedom.

www.aclu.org

Anybody IN THIS COUNTRY. Again, you must be trolling.

 

[IT Minion]

Anybody IN THIS COUNTRY. Again, you must be trolling.

If you want to travel to the US you can't say mean things about Trump. That's the US government stifling free speech of foreign nationals. But they're fine with that.

 

[pete01]

if you say nasty things about Kirk.

Why would you/anyone want to?