Controlling multiple electric heaters centrally

[danlightbulb]

Hi all.

My girlfriends flat is electric only, no economy 7 fitted.

There are several radiant panel heaters installed in the rooms, each one just with a 13A plug. The panels have no in built thermostat, they are just on or off.

There is no central thermostat or timer/programmer for the heating.

There is also a mains pressure hot water cylinder, heated using two immersion elements. These are wired direct into 13A fused spurs, again no programmer/timer.

How can she upgrade this system to have central thermostat and timer control?

We would need devices capable of switching 13A electric panels. Ideally controlled by a single (or maybe two) centrally located room thermostats, and allowing centralised programmer /app functionality. Including the hot water programming ideally.

Having the hot water on a timer might at least allow exploration of overnight cheaper rate electricity tariffs.

Going to gas is impossible, and going to economy 7 probably not an option.

Any ideas or alternatives?

Thanks.

 

[pete01]

Not my area but some sort of simple contactor/ thermostat setup

 

[danlightbulb]

Not my area but some sort of simple contactor/ thermostat setup

Yes so I'm looking for something off the shelf that I can install.

Either we keep the existing wired fused spurs but have a means of switching them from.a central programmer linked to a room stat.

Or we wire all the heaters back to a central contactor / programmer which itself switches the heaters on and off.

I imagine electric only heating is not rare in apartments but I can't find anything which seems designed for this purpose.

 

[pete01]

All I can think of is to wire the 3 heaters through a contactor and have a timer and thermostat switching it.....but that is a really simple way of doing it, someone else will probably come up with a better idea soon.

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

Alexa controlled smart plug adaptors, one per heater, could deal with that, if you added a temperature sensor. My reservation would be, they are not really up to switching a 13 amp load, unless you can track down some more robust ones.

Other than that, all those heaters wired back to a separate consumer unit, and power the CU via a contactor, itself powered from a stat, and timer.

 

[danlightbulb]

Alexa controlled smart plug adaptors, one per heater, could deal with that, if you added a temperature sensor. My reservation would be, they are not really up to switching a 13 amp load, unless you can track down some more robust ones.

Other than that, all those heaters wired back to a separate consumer unit, and power the CU via a contactor, itself powered from a stat, and timer.

There must be an 'official' way this type of thing is done in electric only apartments. That's what I'm looking for. I also need to control the hot water.

The problem with smart plugs is that I'm under the impression it doesn't count on the energy performance certificate. The lack of programmer/thermostats will mean a poor score.

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

The problem with smart plugs is that I'm under the impression it doesn't count on the energy performance certificate. The lack of programmer/thermostats will mean a poor score.

They would need to be storage, and on E7.

 

[danlightbulb]

They would need to be storage, and on E7.

There's no storage heaters or E7 in these apartments. None of them have it. Pretty poor but converted in early 00s I guess it wasn't required then. All the apartments simply had on/off panel heaters installed. I don't know if they have a separate circuit or just on the ring main circuit.

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

There's no storage heaters or E7 in these apartments. None of them have it. Pretty poor but converted in early 00s I guess it wasn't required then.

Which suggests it is rented, and a landlord taking a cheap option to heat the place. Therefore, not much you can do, apart from Alexa plug-ins.

If she owns, it, has her own meters, there is nothing to stop her getting an E7 meter fitted.

 

[danlightbulb]

Perhaps I should ask this question differently.

If you had an apartment with no gas supply, what heating system do you install in the modern day? You can't install solar or a heat pump either, due to it being a 3rd floor flat and leasehold.

 

[danlightbulb]

Which suggests it is rented, and a landlord taking a cheap option to heat the place. Therefore, not much you can do, apart from Alexa plug-ins.

If she owns, it, has her own meters, there is nothing to stop her getting an E7 meter fitted.

She owns it, and is thinking of renting it out when she moves in with me. She has put up with manually controlling the electric heaters and hot water for over 15 years. But that won't cut it for rental.

Problem is installing storage heaters will cost many thousands of pounds, and storage heaters (in my historical experience of them) aren't very good either. I didn't think they were used very much in the modern day.

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

If you had an apartment with no gas supply, what heating system is installed in the modern day? You can't install solar or a heat pump either, due to it being a 3rd floor flat and leasehold.

If the place is regularly occupied, then E7 and storage heaters. If irregularly occupied, then what you have is likely more economical, but they need either time/temperature control added, or to be replaced with heaters which include those controls.

 

[Murdochcat]

Are you sure there isn’t some form of internal thermostat? Something must switch them off internally

What make and model are they?

 

[danlightbulb]

If the place is regularly occupied, then E7 and storage heaters. If irregularly occupied, then what you have is likely more economical, but they need either time/temperature control added, or to be replaced with heaters which include those controls.

I could fit electric heaters which have built in programmers, but there's still then no central control? We could have 5 heaters all set to different temperatures and schedules conflicting with each other in the home.

I don't think E7 is viable. It's never been much good, and these days the electricity rates don't save you much off peak. Would cost thousands to install a few E7 storage heaters (they are near £1000 each for the big ones), likely huge payback period even if she was planning to stay there. And E7 has never been any good if you're at work in the day and want heat in the evening. I don't see E7 being used in new build apartments these days unless I'm mistaken.

Are you sure there isn’t some form of internal thermostat? Something must switch them off internally

What make and model are they?

There's probably a safety stat inside it but nothing external to set. I don't know the brand, it's a simple white flat radiant panel hooked on the wall, not a convector. Cable off it and 13A plug.

 

[robinbanks]

going to economy 7 probably not an option.

When you say that, do you mean it's unlikely you can change electricity tariffs or unlikely you can install storage heaters?

Would a tariff like octopus cosy help? Cheap periods, in the day

Storage heaters aren't so bad, and second hand ones are available for less than new.. You do have to understand how to drive them though