Do I need this skimmed...?

[budest]

Hi guys,

Getting around my sink and worktops in the kitchen tiled and after taking the old tiles off above the sink the top skim started to come off quiet easily as it was boast and I didn't want tiles going on to plaster that was hollow underneath.

Anyhow as tilers would you suggest I get this skimmed? I've supplied photos of the area I am talking about. Noting that the tiler is coming this day week and the last thing I want is for the tiles to go not level after previous bad experience.

What's the verdict then; skimmed or not?

Thanks

 

[Richard C]

What size are your tiles? Problem with using finish plaster on a tile base is the weight restriction which can be a problem if you’re proposing to use large format/heavy tiles & that you will have to wait at least 10 days before you can tile over it. Don’t use base plaster either, it’s not suitable for tiling.

The best way of doing it is to level & fill the wall with powder cement tile adhesive as it gets around both problems.

 

[budest]

What size are your tiles? Problem with using finish plaster on a tile base is the weight restriction which can be a problem if you’re proposing to use large format/heavy tiles & that you will have to wait at least 10 days before you can tile over it. Don’t use base plaster either, it’s not suitable for tiling.

The best way of doing it is to level & fill the wall with powder cement tile adhesive as it gets around both problems.

Hey mate, thanks for the response.

The tile dimensions are: 20x10cms and depth 0.65.

Here is a photo of a few tiles just for image purposes and good measure

What do you think at this stage? I won't be tiling myself it will be a tiler who comes highly recommended.

 

[Richard C]

Small tile & the weight isn't going to be a problem for new plaster so you could rough fill it but use finish plaster not base coat; it doesnlt have to be perfect as long as it's flat & level. 2 coats of PVA over the damaged areas only & plaster while the second is till tacky, don't plaster over dry PVA but you will have to leave it 10 days to dry out. Alternatively use powder adhesive as I suggested but in this case, don't use the PVA.

 

[budest]

Small tile & the weight isn't going to be a problem for new plaster so you could rough fill it but use finish plaster not base coat; it doesnlt have to be perfect as long as it's flat & level. 2 coats of PVA over the damaged areas only & plaster while the second is till tacky, don't plaster over dry PVA but you will have to leave it 10 days to dry out. Alternatively use powder adhesive as I suggested but in this case, don't use the PVA.

Thanks again Richard.

Was on the phone to the tiler today who said that this happens quite regularly and not to worry (as I expressed I was) as he will level it out with adhesive and as he uses a spirit level on the tiled wall he will ensure everything is level.

Does this make sense to you?

 

[Richard C]

Does this make sense to you?

Yes as long as he uses a cement powder adhesive to level/fill the wall & doesn’t try to pack out/fill with tub ready mix but he will most probably use tub ready mix for tiles that size. That’s the way I would do it.

 

[budest]

Considering that I purchased the stuff for him, ie grout etc, I got the tub stuff so maybe I should grab a bag of the powder stuff also.

Thanks

 

[Richard C]

Tub adhesive is OK for your size tiles & filling out the odd bit here & there but I definitely wouldn’t use it to fill out to the extent I can see in your photos. The problem is tub mix is evaporative cure & only suitable for around 3mm bed thickness. If you start to exceed this to any appreciable degree, it’s going to take an age to go off & the tiles could start moving around. In extreme cases the has not cure for many weeks & I’ve know tiles fall off
as a result. Powder cement adhesive is chemical cure, Rapidset as quickly as 2 hours; normal bed thickness is 2-6mm but can be used up to 12mm for local leveling/filling.

What products has he sold you? You’ve only small tiles which shouldn’t present too many challenges but beware cheap own brand & DIY materials, they are mostly crap.

 

[budest]

Great information there Richard, much appreciated.

I bought the stuff myself from Homebase on Saturday mate as they had a 15% sale on.

What has just dawned on me though is that this stuff is for "Shower & Bathroom" and whilst I am getting my bathroom walls tiled too, is this suitable for kitchens?

It's a swell I checked there..

 

[Richard C]

Oh dear Unibomb ; take it back get a refund & buy something that will actually work. As I said your tiles are not very challenging but that stuff has a notorious reputation & IMO most combined adhesive & grout products break the trades description act by going under the guise of “tiling products”; I doubt you’d find any decent pro tiler prepared to use either. Use the search facility on this or any Tilers forum to check what those in the trade have to say about it.

You need to use a quality trade adhesive & grout; BAL is all I use but Webber, Granfix, Mapei (but not the stuff in BNQ) to name a few are just as good. Topps sell quality products but will charge you an arm & a leg if your not trade or can’t convince them you are. Look up your local independent trade tile outlet, they will stock decent tiling products & won’t rip you off. &, please, no fix-n-grout; if you asked me to tile with it, I’d close the door behind me on my way out!

Before you do your bathroom which will be more challenging, make sure you read the Tiling Sticky & Forum archive posts; it may save you making disastrous & potentially expensive mistakes.

 

[tpt]

i could smell that one coming - richard is dead right though. the sheds usually charge a lot for this crap too.

 

[budest]

Oh dear Unibomb ; take it back get a refund & buy something that will actually work. As I said your tiles are not very challenging but that stuff has a notorious reputation & IMO most combined adhesive & grout products break the trades description act by going under the guise of “tiling products”; I doubt you’d find any decent pro tiler prepared to use either. Use the search facility on this or any Tilers forum to check what those in the trade have to say about it.

You need to use a quality trade adhesive & grout; BAL is all I use but Webber, Granfix, Mapei (but not the stuff in BNQ) to name a few are just as good. Topps sell quality products but will charge you an arm & a leg if your not trade or can’t convince them you are. Look up your local independent trade tile outlet, they will stock decent tiling products & won’t rip you off. &, please, no fix-n-grout; if you asked me to tile with it, I’d close the door behind me on my way out!

Before you do your bathroom which will be more challenging, make sure you read the Tiling Sticky & Forum archive posts; it may save you making disastrous & potentially expensive mistakes.

I hear ya.

OK I have a Topps in Belfast that I will bet the BAL stuff from tomorrow m8.
Could you maybe link me to what exactly I will need if you have the time and energy?

http://www.toppstiles.co.uk/section136/page1/bal-tile-adhesives-and-bal-grouts/

I need 5m2 for bathroom walls that are in good condition,

4m2 for bathroom floor (concrete)

5m2 for kitchen walls including the damaged bit as above.

I just need grout and adhesive.

Thanks so much for all the help.

 

[Richard C]

Could you maybe link me to what exactly I will need if you have the time and energy?

Christ do you want me to come & lay them for you as well!

I need 5m2 for bathroom walls that are in good condition,

Can’t advise that until I know what your walls are made of/covered with & what size/type/weight tiles your intending.

4m2 for bathroom floor (concrete)

Can’t advise that until I know what your floor is made of, the joist details & what size/type tiles your intending.

5m2 for kitchen walls including the damaged bit as above.

As long as you have no plaster board on other walls;
For the filling/levelling;
http://www.toppstiles.co.uk/tprod2948/section172/Bal-Rapidset-Grey-20KG.html

for that size tile I always use White Star http://www.bal-adhesives.co.uk/products/white-star which is not listed (but I though Topps stocked it),otherwise for ceramics go for Grip; http://www.toppstiles.co.uk/section1337/page1/bal-tile-adhesive

For grout: http://www.toppstiles.co.uk/section173/page1/tile-grout/

 

[Symptoms]

bud - the NI builders merchant Haldane Fisher do BAL products ... they have 10 branches all over NI.