Expansion gap larger than skirting for first row!! Pls help!

[waterl00]

Hi there

I've just brought a solid wood floor which I'm about to lay.

Reading the instructions, and general guidance on the web says to leave at least 12mm gap around the perimeter of the floor.

However, on the first row, if I leave a 12mm gap, the 'tongue' of the boards 3 or 4mm means that there's a visible gap between the skirting board and first row.

I'm thinking of either:

1) Just leaving a 7mm expansiion gap, then keeping the skirting off for a while to see if the gap is sufficient, then if it closes cut off the tongue with something like a drimmel

2) Just cutting off the tongue first and keeping a 12mm expnsion gap.

Any advice would be gratefully received as I play to fix the first 3 rows this weekend

 

[big-all]

acclimatising the boards is all important
leaving the correct gap is equally important
with your skirting being 15-22mm thick you will be fine just cut off the tounge and leave a 12mm gap less gap your warranty is invalid so not worth the trouble for a few mins removing the tounge

 

[WoodYouLike]

How wide is your room - so how wide will your wooden floor be (sometime the floorboards are installed parallel to the shortest wall, making the total width for the wooden floor as wide as the length of the room).
For every meter width of wooden floor you need 3 - 4mm expansion gap, with a minimum of 12 in your case (due to manufacturer's instructions). Based on this and the rule of thumbs, if your floor will be wider than 3 meter you'll have to leave an even wider gap than 12mm.

Do the instruction say you'll have to start with the Tongue towards the wall?? How are you going to install the floor? Floating, nailing, gluieng down?

 

[waterl00]

hi guys - thanks for all your replies.

Its a garage conversion so its a narrow long room 4.5 long x 2.5 wide. I'm laying down on chipboard (above dpm and 100mm celotex and 5mm chipboard - installing as a floating floor.

The oak floor is from Wickes 18mm solid wood and I'll be installing using glue at short ends and clips at long ends as per the instructions. I've read in numerous places not to float solid wood, but I want to in this room 1) to keep gurantee 2) if anything happends under the floor I can pull it up. I'm using this stuff for the remainder of the downstairs where it will be professionally glude down on to concrete.

Instructions do say point Toungue towards the wall, but I think it will be easier just to take this off first to ensure the expanison gap to save any potential grief later.

 

[WoodYouLike]

If you point Tongue towards wall you'll have to glue the groove of the board that is already down when the next row is installed - messy job, glue can drip out of the groove, spill on the underlayment and "stick" the floor down.
Switch the boards around, start with the groove side to the wall and glue the groove of the board that will slot in the row already down when you start the second row.

Other question for you: the length of the boards - many short lengths?

 

[WoodYouLike]

Edit - hadn't properly read about the clips for the long joints, but still.

In our experience these clips are useless and you'll end up glueing the T&G anyway

 

[waterl00]

Yes, I've seen lots of bad posts around the clips, but thought I'd give them ago first - as some say they are ok - and if they do work should prevent less movement than the glue (?) for a floating floor.

There are ALOT of short pieces - in first 4 packs there are just 2 full lengths. This means that I can't follow the instructions to the word as they state that overlapping joints should not be less that 300mm. However, this means that each board would have to be at least 600mm which is not the case!!!

Any advice on how to best use these short pieces?

 

[WoodYouLike]

Fully bond them, that's all I can say. Installing this type of floor (which does come with many short boards standard, hence the fully bonding in the other room) floating will make it unstable. And you can't fully bond on chipboard I'm afraid.

Other solution would be to use Elastilon self-adhesive underlayment to get a more decent result.

 

[mointainwalker]

@ WYL

For every meter width of wooden floor you need 3 - 4mm expansion gap

Can you clarify if this is per side or half each side ?

 

[waterl00]

thanks Wood You Like.

When you say fully bond them - do you mean glue both long and short sides? I'm really reluctant to glue all sides, just in case I need to pull up the floor. I think I'll try the clips first.

Would you mind explaining why I can't glue directly onto chipboard? I don't intend to, but I had a guy round (who will be gluing down in hall and dining room onto concrete) who said he'd glue to the chipboard!

 

[WoodYouLike]

@ WYL

For every meter width of wooden floor you need 3 - 4mm expansion gap

Can you clarify if this is per side or half each side ?

Each side, always. Calculate the expansion gap by measuring what the width of the wooden floor will be in meters, multiply the meters by 3.5 (average) which gives you the gap width ALL AROUND the wooden floor you need to keep.

The 3 - 4 mm per meter width rule is for Solid Oak floorboards, pine boards are different (4 - 5mm) and Solid beech even 7mm per meter!

Wood-engineered boards differ from this: minimum 10mm, if the wooden floor will be wider than 5 meters, increase the gap to 12 - 15mm

 

[WoodYouLike]

thanks Wood You Like.

When you say fully bond them - do you mean glue both long and short sides? I'm really reluctant to glue all sides, just in case I need to pull up the floor. I think I'll try the clips first.

Would you mind explaining why I can't glue directly onto chipboard? I don't intend to, but I had a guy round (who will be gluing down in hall and dining room onto concrete) who said he'd glue to the chipboard!

No, I mean that the best thing to do with a quality like this is to fully glue them to a suitable underfloor with flexible adhesive, using a correct notched trowel to spread out the adhesive on the underfloor.

Modern chipboard has a moist repellent surface which do not allow the adhesive to do its work.
Ask your fitter if he can guarantee your chipboard is different than standard, then ask for a guarantee it will stay in place - bonded down - for the normal expected time (10 - 15 years at least). Have this put in writing!

 

[waterl00]

The chipboard I laid down was definately the modern type. It was slightly green in colour with moisture repellant.

That Elastion product you recommended looks asthough it would make things much simpler. Is it easy to install? Does this stick both sides i.e. both to the floor and the wood or would it just stick on the underside of the floor?

If it does need to stick to the chipbaord too - would this stick to the chipboard I have?

I did ask the fitter about a gurantee. The problem is the fact I have sourced the materials seperately. He said he would gurantee the labour so it would be very easy for him to just blame the quality of the wood if anything did go wrong.

Starting to think I should have just brought wood and labour from one source!!

 

[WoodYouLike]

The Elastilon you need only sticks on one side, the one where the wood floor goes. It will be a bit tricky in the beginning, but you'll get the hang of it pretty soon.

 

[waterl00]

Just been reading up on Elastilon and watched the installation video's - it does look so much easier to install!!

One thing I can't seem to find is how long the product lasts for? Does the adhesive have any longevity? Do you have any knowledge of this?

I've already purchased and opened fibre board from wickes and spent £15 on a box of clips but this method definately looks like the best way to go. My only remaining question mark is over how long it will last for.