fitting tap off boxes

[industryspark]

would like other peoples opinions please.

been installing a tap off box today on a high level busbar trunking. as usual when doing this i isolated the busbar and did the job no problem. the new manager of the works though didnt appreciate the downtime however and insisted it was safe to do it live.

personally i think this is b*llox and told him so, i would sight regulation 14 of the electricity at work regulations as the defence

''no work shall be performed on or so near to live conductors that danger may arise unless it is totally unreasonable in all circumstances to be isolated''

it goes something like that anyway!

just wondered what others do in regards to the busbar trunking.

maybe im been overcautious but then again i bet getting a belt from one of these would smart!

 

[industryspark]

just for reference the busbar is 400v 315A!

 

[Pensdown]

Assuming the IR test you carried out on the tap off box was clear before you plugged it in, what other risks did you identify that worried you?

 

[industryspark]

working at height off a scaffold for one and also in a confined space.

condition of the busbar is maybe a bit of an unknown quantity as its old and has obvoiusly never had any maintenance. also the spacings between supports for the busbar i dont think are adequate and u get a certain degree of 'flex' when pushing the tap off box in.

the tap off box didnt go in easy either-took a certain degree of force.

 

[Spark123]

If he wanted you to do it live make sure you have a proper job specific risk assessment, all of the procedures are adhered to, correct tools used and correct PPE worn. Working live in this way should only ever be done as a last resort.

 

[industryspark]

your right in what you say spark but im sure uve come across similar people who think that the worst electricity can do is make you jump a little!

anyways i got my way in the end and shall continue to isolate when doing this kind of work.

how do you feel about changing fuses in the tap off box whilst the busbar is still live?
me personally ive done this before, although....

heard a story when doing my apprentiship about a guy who was changing fuses in a tap off box and didnt prove dead. he didnt see that the box had all melted and 2 of the pins had come away from the door and remained located in the terminals when he opened the 'door' to 'isolate'.

he got away unscathed but for a few broken bones aswell apparently!

 

[Pensdown]

To be honest, the concept of bus bar installations is to allow you to add circuits without shut downs but the age, type and other factors must be assessed before it’s done and that also applies to changing fuses.

We have very strict procedures for live working, mainly because we do a lot of it. Our engineers are involved in the risk assessment procedure and if there’re not happy we either change the way were going to do it or if that’s not practical we simply don’t do it. We never take risks.

As Spark123 said make sure you carry out a job specific risk assessment and if you use the graph type – likelihood against severity this will tell you whether you should be doing it live or not.

 

[Spark123]

how do you feel about changing fuses in the tap off box whilst the busbar is still live?
me personally ive done this before, although....

I think it's job specific, if all terminals are shrouded so no live parts are exposed then the risks involved are considerably less than those posed by bare bus-bars. I know there are times where you just want to get the job done and out of the way (bait time, down time, management pressure etc) but at the end of the day, sometimes you have to take a step back and think what-if?? Is it really worth the risk? If in any doubt whatsoever stop and seek advice. I think we have all taken un-necessary risks before by doing something we shouldn't have but this is no excuse, next time we may not be so lucky.

 

[industryspark]

Thanks for the views guys, always helpfull to know what others think about things.

im interested in the risk assesments you talk about pensdown. ive been trying to get my works to implement these for some time but they're not keen.

where can i see examples of electrical ones like you talk about pens? ive seen the working at height type but never electrical ones.

looks like it might be down to me to try and push the risk assesments through.

 

[Pensdown]

im interested in the risk assesments you talk about pensdown. ive been trying to get my works to implement these for some time but they're not keen.

I'm not who you work for but they have a legal obligation to carry out risk assessments.


If you drop me an e-mail I'll happily send you a few samples.

 

[industryspark]

ive sent you an email so if you could forward me some id be very gratefull.

cheers mate, ill go about getting these implemented at work asap.

 

[Pensdown]

On there way