nice work, greeny4, but you won't get 10 pages from me.
Good luck, take care
Flash-bang with Multimeter?
- Thread starter Hib
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nice work, greeny4, but you won't get 10 pages from me.
Good luck, take care
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We're gonna have to clear something up here. I'm well aware that my comments (especially my earlier ones) revealed some ignorance. That's because i read up on this stuff 2 1/2 years ago and then pretty much forgot a afair bit of the detail (as u do when u cover something for the first time and then almost completely forget about it for that 2 1/2 years].
E.g. when i asked about the power being on for some tests i couldn't remember exactly if there were some circumstances where power could be on for C-testing, but either way i was pretty sure that there would be no serious consequences (i may not have been able to tell u exactly in technical detail why i was safe but i knew that i was - similar to the way a person knows he can drive a car w/o knowing wot kind of fuel it takes).
When i was working at a flat and there was a problem cooker i had my meter and knew that the only functions that i needed were continuity
(see here listed as 'diode and buzzer' - http://www.skytronic.com/rsc/man/600/600_006.pdf
and AC high voltage (750v)
I knew that all the other options were of no interest to me. When i first bought the meter I did some testing on sockets etc, and confirmed that it's not that complicated - when i want to use the meter in future, a little bit of messing about for a couple of minutes and i'll remember all that needs to be remembered. I know enough to know that i'm not in any significant physical danger with my options so limited and a little bit of common sense.
The circuit is protected, i have an insulated meter, the cooker is between 10 and 20 years old - it's probably not even worth fixing - i'm just having a bit of fun. From my knowledge i know that there is no significant danger even if i'm not 100% on the technical side of absolutely everything i'm doing - i know that as long as i stick to the above the worst that will probably happen is some electrics get melted and even that is extremely unlikely. If for some very odd reason there is a problem either the meter will blow (£10), the MCB will trip , or the cooker will blow - i'm not really that concerned if any of these things happen - it's no big deal.
And i was right - as others have confirmed - there should not have been a problem - it's something of a mystery that there was a problem. That's really all i needed to know. I was enjoying and appreciating Pinocchio's help and good humour up until Rocket started talking rubbish - "u're lucky to be alive"; spare me. Pinocchio then lost the courage of his convictions did a full u-turn and decided to join Rocket. Until then Pinocchio had been spot on.
But Pinocchio instead of simply saying that he changed his mind, made a complete fool of himself by his subsequent ridiculous posts. Of course u don't want to reply Mike - u've been utterly hammered - by ur own stupidity.
Now for u Health and safety pedants - for the last time SHUT UP. Go and worship at the sacred altar of H&S elsewhere. i bet u people don't even allow ur children to climb trees - much safer to sit them in front of the brain melter (TV). If ur that fond of being good little comrades move to Russia.
And Love"ur lucky to be alive"Rocket - if ur that fond of pointless drama -move to Hollywood.
Sheds u really must read the thread b4 wasting my time with ur cheeky teenager comments.
Because other people keep talking about an ohmmeter test rather than a continuity test - one of the 'terrifying' reasons given that i shouldn't test live is that it will give inaccurate results, which would not be an issue if we stuck to the facts - it's a continuity test - buzzer or no buzzer, on or off, black or white. There is no reading for the power to distort as with an ohmmeter test.
I now consider the question answered, nothing should've melted down. But even though nothing should've, something did - which is good to know. And u H&S weirdos can maintain ur silence on that, thank u. We all recognise the H&S aspect, we just don't all feel the need to talk about it from morning to night at the expense of common sense, experimentation and a little fun.
Thanks to those who genuinely tried to help.
To those who didn't - get a life
E.g. when i asked about the power being on for some tests i couldn't remember exactly if there were some circumstances where power could be on for C-testing, but either way i was pretty sure that there would be no serious consequences (i may not have been able to tell u exactly in technical detail why i was safe but i knew that i was - similar to the way a person knows he can drive a car w/o knowing wot kind of fuel it takes).
When i was working at a flat and there was a problem cooker i had my meter and knew that the only functions that i needed were continuity
(see here listed as 'diode and buzzer' - http://www.skytronic.com/rsc/man/600/600_006.pdf
and AC high voltage (750v)
I knew that all the other options were of no interest to me. When i first bought the meter I did some testing on sockets etc, and confirmed that it's not that complicated - when i want to use the meter in future, a little bit of messing about for a couple of minutes and i'll remember all that needs to be remembered. I know enough to know that i'm not in any significant physical danger with my options so limited and a little bit of common sense.
The circuit is protected, i have an insulated meter, the cooker is between 10 and 20 years old - it's probably not even worth fixing - i'm just having a bit of fun. From my knowledge i know that there is no significant danger even if i'm not 100% on the technical side of absolutely everything i'm doing - i know that as long as i stick to the above the worst that will probably happen is some electrics get melted and even that is extremely unlikely. If for some very odd reason there is a problem either the meter will blow (£10), the MCB will trip , or the cooker will blow - i'm not really that concerned if any of these things happen - it's no big deal.
And i was right - as others have confirmed - there should not have been a problem - it's something of a mystery that there was a problem. That's really all i needed to know. I was enjoying and appreciating Pinocchio's help and good humour up until Rocket started talking rubbish - "u're lucky to be alive"; spare me. Pinocchio then lost the courage of his convictions did a full u-turn and decided to join Rocket. Until then Pinocchio had been spot on.
But Pinocchio instead of simply saying that he changed his mind, made a complete fool of himself by his subsequent ridiculous posts. Of course u don't want to reply Mike - u've been utterly hammered - by ur own stupidity.
Now for u Health and safety pedants - for the last time SHUT UP. Go and worship at the sacred altar of H&S elsewhere. i bet u people don't even allow ur children to climb trees - much safer to sit them in front of the brain melter (TV). If ur that fond of being good little comrades move to Russia.
And Love"ur lucky to be alive"Rocket - if ur that fond of pointless drama -move to Hollywood.
John do really expect me to believe that that's a genuine misunderstanding? - go awayjohn1 said:
Sheds said:
Sheds u really must read the thread b4 wasting my time with ur cheeky teenager comments.
Because other people keep talking about an ohmmeter test rather than a continuity test - one of the 'terrifying' reasons given that i shouldn't test live is that it will give inaccurate results, which would not be an issue if we stuck to the facts - it's a continuity test - buzzer or no buzzer, on or off, black or white. There is no reading for the power to distort as with an ohmmeter test.
I now consider the question answered, nothing should've melted down. But even though nothing should've, something did - which is good to know. And u H&S weirdos can maintain ur silence on that, thank u. We all recognise the H&S aspect, we just don't all feel the need to talk about it from morning to night at the expense of common sense, experimentation and a little fun.
Thanks to those who genuinely tried to help.
To those who didn't - get a life
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I'm not sure which category I'm in...I only asked one simple question and suggested a way of clearing up any confusion as to what was happening.
I haven't had a response to either posts.
What, in your mind, makes you think it's OK for you to use your meter for, or on, anything whatsoever when you clearly have no idea what it does, or how?
And if you think I'm wrong, please write an explanation of what continuity is, and how it is measured, and in what units, i.e. what is your meter looking for to decide whether to buzz or not. Maybe looking at what it says about that on p16 of the manual will give you a clue.
Or maybe not.
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Hib/greeny
i don't really want to reply since you are either a troll or just to thick to understand what you have done, but i've got a moment spare.
Without naming names, i think it is clear who is demonstrating their stupidity. Can you work it out?
try not to get too upset, maybe you are good in other aspects of life. -maybe painting and decorating?
i don't really want to reply since you are either a troll or just to thick to understand what you have done, but i've got a moment spare.
Without naming names, i think it is clear who is demonstrating their stupidity. Can you work it out?
try not to get too upset, maybe you are good in other aspects of life. -maybe painting and decorating?
I wouldn't like to connect it into a live circuit to test continuity as when you bridge an opening in it you'll be feeding 240v directly into the diode and buzzer setting ckt which are designed to check diodes and closed circuits, the unit itself providing only a few volts for checking closed circuits hence the reason it beeps when you touch the two probes together. Continuity is, as others have said, a dead test - the multimeter providing all power needed for this test.
You get similar results using it set to ohms and reading the display.
If I was to test a cooker (or any circuit) with it live like this I'd be using a volts setting.
You get similar results using it set to ohms and reading the display.
If I was to test a cooker (or any circuit) with it live like this I'd be using a volts setting.
No offence but you clearly do not understand first principles, let alone what the bits you are testing are supposed to be and what they should measure so you need to leave things to someone who does, otherwise a simple repair could escalate out of control!
Just to clarify, continuity (which you should only use if you expect a very low resistance, which I would suggest you don't!) is not to be tested with power applied. Good quality meters like Fluke etc.. may be able to cope up to 1000v tops a £10 will possibly cope up to it's own internal battery voltage at best. Even then the results will be meaningless in all meters!
[/u]
Just to clarify, continuity (which you should only use if you expect a very low resistance, which I would suggest you don't!) is not to be tested with power applied. Good quality meters like Fluke etc.. may be able to cope up to 1000v tops a £10 will possibly cope up to it's own internal battery voltage at best. Even then the results will be meaningless in all meters!
[/u]
This thread just goes to show...
that a little bit of knowledge is very dangerous.
that a little bit of knowledge is very dangerous.
Not as long as you realise you only have a little knowledge, and act accordingly.
I have very little knowledge of open heart surgery. But I realise that, and I'm not stupid enough to think that because I know which is the sharp end of a scalpel I'm OK to start opening people up.
I have very little knowledge of open heart surgery. But I realise that, and I'm not stupid enough to think that because I know which is the sharp end of a scalpel I'm OK to start opening people up.
When you know you don't know something you can look it up, get a pro in or whatever.
The problem comes when you think you know what you need to know to do something but your knowlage is either incorrect or incomplete.
For example there are diy books that purport to tell you how to do doestic wiring including things like supplying outbuildings but are both very outdated in the regs they were written based on and completely ignore the important issues of volt drop, disconnect times and testing.
The problem comes when you think you know what you need to know to do something but your knowlage is either incorrect or incomplete.
For example there are diy books that purport to tell you how to do doestic wiring including things like supplying outbuildings but are both very outdated in the regs they were written based on and completely ignore the important issues of volt drop, disconnect times and testing.
Fellas don't think i haven't noticed the attempt to avoid answering the question:
How does live continuity testing cause a 30 - 32 amp fuse to blow and a cooker to melt down?
As Spark123's, SecureSpark's and Mike's answers (among others) indicate - it doesn't
Don't bother reverse arguing by saying 'well it did, therefore it does'.
In theory, C-testing should not've caused the problem.
Someone explain from theory alone how C-testing caused the problem (without sidestepping the question by saying 'it could damage the meter' or 'it will give inaccurate results').
And to pre-empt the already used 'enlightened' subterfuge - "it could damage the components" - How could it damage the components? Assuming i didn't short anything by mistake - how could live continuity testing cause the problem?
How does live continuity testing cause a 30 - 32 amp fuse to blow and a cooker to melt down?
As Spark123's, SecureSpark's and Mike's answers (among others) indicate - it doesn't
Don't bother reverse arguing by saying 'well it did, therefore it does'.
In theory, C-testing should not've caused the problem.
Someone explain from theory alone how C-testing caused the problem (without sidestepping the question by saying 'it could damage the meter' or 'it will give inaccurate results').
And to pre-empt the already used 'enlightened' subterfuge - "it could damage the components" - How could it damage the components? Assuming i didn't short anything by mistake - how could live continuity testing cause the problem?
How about you explain, in theory, how it doesnt or shouldn't cause a problem????? If a 32Amp mcb triped then you, your probe, your meter or you spurs have shorted something out! perhaps the bit fell out of your horses mouth and into the cooker while you were not looking?
We DONT do live testing for continuity with a multi meter, however, we DO check earth fault loop impedance with an earth fault loop impedance tester.
John1 said:
Well, why am i not surprised that there aren't so many comments on that one. Notice John has completely avoided the question (like a professional liar).
This was my original question Johnny boy, and i want u or someone else to answer it. How could live C-testing, w/o a short being caused, have caused a 32a MCB to trip and a cooker to melt down. Prove to us all that u are willing to be honest and answer it w/o trying to change the subject.
I'm not claiming to be an authority - the others here are - it should be very easy for an expert such as urself to answer the question.
Just say it Johnny
M
MrsBanal
If you look inside your multimeter, you'll probably find a some MOV's. A low voltage MOV is often engaged when you select a resistance/continuity test to protect the meter (which equals a bang).
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