High electricity consumption at night

[Roger465]

My daughter is getting very high electricity bills in her tower block flat. These predate the recent increases, so God knows what they’ll be now…

She spoke to an extremely rude and unhelpful woman at SWALEC, who told her that the excessive consumption was at night.

She’s on some kind of dual tariff (Economy 7 type, I guess – she’s spectacularly ignorant of these things), and there are two things which concern me:

(1) Her immersion heater doesn't appear to have any kind of timer on it – is this possible? Could it be running all the time?

(2) She appears to have 3 storage heaters, but says she only turns them on occasionally if it’s very cold, which isn't often. I’ve attached a picture of the control on one – she turns it to the left symbol (manual on?) when she wants heat. But surely, for it to give out heat, it would have to have been charged up at night first??? Does this mean that she’s paying to charge the rads every night, then not using them except when she occasionally wants heat?

Daughters FFS…

 

[ETAF]

I'm just a DIYer
But had to play with a few storage heater issue over the last few years - with excessive bills

(1) Her immersion heater doesn't appear to have any kind of timer on it – is this possible? Could it be running all the time?

yes if switched on

But depending on when she draws the water off and its heating, this maybe during the day and not shown on the night readings so much

so if she empties all the hotwater at 9pm, then the heater will heat the water from 9pm and maybe fully heated by 12:00, which maybe when the cheap rate switches on , but the immersion heater has done its job and heated the tank
if the tank is not insulated and in a loft , in the cold the tank may cool down and the heater comes on again

(2) she turns it to the left symbol (manual on?) when she wants heat. ..... Does this mean that she’s paying to charge the rads every night, then not using them except when she occasionally wants heat?

If she is charging at night , then they would let out heat during the day - The storage I have played with, you can control to some extent how quickly the heat is allowed out, not sure how, but thats what the instructions say
Usually the Storage heaters are wired up to a timer so they can only come on in the night and not in the day
But they can also just been on a normal circuit and consume power all the time if on.
But that would also be shown on the daytime readings

https://www.cse.org.uk/advice/advice-and-support/night-storage-heaters

do you have a make and model for that heater and is it a storage heater and not a normal heater ?

But if they have identified the consumption is at night on the E7 meter readings, then during the day it would not matter if she witched on/off

The E7 meter reading will be set to 7hours at night , and then another reading for the daytime

I assume her bill does have 2 sets of meter readings @ different rates ?

 

[ericmark]

E7 or E10 is a tariff not a system. There are many ways to use it, from a special fuse box which only becomes live at night, to a signal wire to tell an appliance when to switch on, to clock on the appliance.

In the beginning the off peak was around 1/3 of peak and you paid more for the peak than other users, but the differential has reduced and not certain if worth while any more.

But having a storage radiator does not mean you have the tariff, except in Scotland it is being phased out, so step one is see if still on a off peak tariff.

 

[333rocky333]

Would not have thought that timer is for the storage heater, some heaters are storage heaters with a back up convector heater built in, its possible the timer is for the convector heater, when you look at the heater is there 2 flexes going into it from two separate control boxes.

 

[Roger465]

Would not have thought that timer is for the storage heater, some heaters are storage heaters with a back up convector heater built in, its possible the timer is for the convector heater, when you look at the heater is there 2 flexes going into it from two separate control boxes.

Hhmmm, that's interesting - didn't know that was a possibility. I'll find out...

I assume her bill does have 2 sets of meter readings @ different rates ?

Yes, and here's a pic of the consumer unit (one of them):

 

[Roger465]

Would not have thought that timer is for the storage heater, some heaters are storage heaters with a back up convector heater built in, its possible the timer is for the convector heater, when you look at the heater is there 2 flexes going into it from two separate control boxes.

Does this look like what you're suggesting?

 

[Roger465]

And what's this exactly?

 

[Diver Fred]

The picture in your first posting looks to me like the controller on a panel heater rather than a Night Storage Heater. The switch is in the 'Off' position.

First recommendation is for her to switch OFF the 3 Night Storage Heaters in the consumer unit.

Does your daughter know how to read a meter?
Then she will be able to tell if a, she has been switching the heaters on or off; b, the change to her consumption.

 

[Roger465]

The picture in your first posting looks to me like the controller on a panel heater rather than a Night Storage Heater. The switch is in the 'Off' position.

First recommendation is for her to switch OFF the 3 Night Storage Heaters in the consumer unit.

Does your daughter know how to read a meter?
Then she will be able to tell if a, she has been switching the heaters on or off; b, the change to her consumption.

Oh, believe me, I've been trying to get her to check the meters night and morning... but it's cold/dark/wet/scary etc.

I'm persevering...

 

[ETAF]

are the bills estimated ?
Does she have a smart meter providing readings to the supply company

should be able to see if Estimated, Customer Reading , Or their Reading, code by the meter reading on the bill.

Expansion vessel for the Central heating , the heating is pressurised and this vessel compensates for changes in pressure when heating hot/cold

Picture of the meter - if electronic, then you see a flashing led, faster as more electric is consumed

 

[Roger465]

are the bills estimated ?
Does she have a smart meter providing readings to the supply company

No smart meter, but I'll ask about the bill.

Expansion vessel for the Central heating , the heating is pressurised and this vessel compensates for changes in pressure when heating hot/cold

Just one problem... the block doesn't have central heating

 

[333rocky333]

Does this look like what you're suggesting?

View attachment 261857

Yes it does, 1 switch does normal and 1 is the storage, looks like they have lights on them, you may find 1 lights 24 hour and the other only during off peak, that would need to be on for the storage heaters to charge overnight.
If she looks under the gap between heater and floor she should see 2 flexes into it, if its a dual unit.
Then again without seeing more of the heater it could well be just a convector heater with the storage switch not connected at all

 

[333rocky333]

Just one problem... the block doesn't have central heating

Without it i think the immersion tank would explode


https://www.easyflow.co.uk/articles/what-is-an-expansion-vessel-for

 

[JohnW2]

View attachment 261841 My daughter is getting very high electricity bills in her tower block flat. These predate the recent increases, so God knows what they’ll be now…

You don't seem to have told how high these bills are which your daughter (and maybe also yourself) regard as 'very high'.

Havre the bills always been 'very high', or has there been a change?

Kind Regards, John

 

[Roger465]

You don't seem to have told how high these bills are which your daughter (and maybe also yourself) regard as 'very high'.

Havre the bills always been 'very high', or has there been a change?

Kind Regards, John

Well... last quarterly one was £270 for a one-bed flat in the middle of a block. It's warm (maybe from the flat underneath, I don't know) and she rarely puts the radiator on.

£90 a month seems excessive?

I think she said it went up a lot maybe 6 months ago, but I'm not sure...