Hypothetical question involving potential insurance fraud

[mikehammer69]

Let's say thieves gain access to a lockbox or a back door is left unlocked

They enter house and ransack it and make off with 10000s worth

You realise home insurance doesn't cover it because they didn't have to break in

Would you fake a break in by smashing a patio door glass and would you expect to get away with this

Or would you suck up the loss

 

[motorbiking]

Faking something is fraud. You usually get prison/suspended prison, but who knows under the current government. Its a conviction for Fraud none the less, so expect that to cause employment issues.
In the hypothetical scenario, the person may have no knowledge as to how the thieves gained access and opted to change the locks immediately.

 

[mikehammer69]

Good point

So if you changed the locks would insurance accept there was a break in

Insurance knows all the tricks. Determining if there was break in will be on their checklist

 

[motorbiking]

In an entirely different scenario I had a break in a few years ago, got my MTB and TT bikes nicked. I couldn't figure out how they got through the door lock. I came out to find the up an over a jar and the bikes gone. I changed the mechanism straight away. Insurance paid out up to the cap. I assumed they were able to slide something underneath. There is always the nagging doubt that the door was left unlocked. You can never be 100% sure.

 

[Ihavenojob]

Would the police come and check, or just give you a crime number to give to your insurers?

 

[mikehammer69]

Would the police come and check, or just give you a crime number to give to your insurers?

That was mostly the reason for my question . Police and Insurance investigation if any.

It seems a simple matter to break a window and fake a break-in but these lies can unravel when queried by police or insurance investigator who may ask the right questions or spot something is amiss with the story

 

[big-all]

my thoughts

yes 100% a criminal act not because you lied as such but because fraud/false witness and returning signed paperwork make it fraud by deception
now iff you have been paying your insurance for perhaps 35 to 40 years in the present house with no claims for 25 to 30 years then close to zero checks are a likly outcome but if like me you cant tell a lie you may still come unstuck by even a basic phone call

 

[Mottie]

Could they have picked the lock? Can you change the locks for a higher security type of lock and just let the ins co decide. Are there any scratches on your lock?

 

[johnny2007]

My friend found his house upside down after a weekend away.
Both doors were still locked, windows all closed properly.
He could never understand how they got in and out.
His insurance paid out, including new locks.
I suspect someone must've copied his key at work, where they leave bags in the mess room for 8 hours but he's adamant they're all honest there.

 

[mikehammer69]

My friend found his house upside down after a weekend away.
Both doors were still locked, windows all closed properly.
He could never understand how they got in and out.
His insurance paid out, including new locks.
I suspect someone must've copied his key at work, where they leave bags in the mess room for 8 hours but he's adamant they're all honest there.

Interesting

No forced entry but they still paid out

 

[johnny2007]

Interesting

No forced entry but they still paid out

Possibly, and this is just me speculating, in today's world, thieves have become more sophisticated and they can cut a key just from a picture.
Leave your keys unattended for 30 seconds and they're in business.
Then it's only a matter of following you home and wait for you to go out again.
Are insurance companies aware of such possibility?
Maybe.
That's why probably he got paid despite no forced entry.

 

[Ihavenojob]

That was mostly the reason for my question . Police and Insurance investigation if any.

It seems a simple matter to break a window and fake a break-in but these lies can unravel when queried by police or insurance investigator who may ask the right questions or spot something is amiss with the story

I had a few thousand pound worth of fishing tackle stolen from my shed about 30 years ago. I reported it to the police, they never came round, just gave me a crime number via a letter about a week later, it was headed " Dear Victim", lovely. Insurance sent a loss adjuster round, I said it was pointless as there was nothing to see- it had gone! They insisted. When he turned up I showed him where the shed was, he said he's not there for that, he just wanted to check all my doors and windows had locks on, as per the policy, as if there was any discrepancy they wouldn' have paid a penny. Luckily all was OK, and i eventually got weighed out.

 

[Lower]

We had an attempted break in last year. The thieves tried to lever the door frame out of the brick work. Thankfully (or not) we were in so the ran off when i turned the lights on and they saw me in the kitchen in my PJ's brandishing my son's hockey stick. Enough to scare even the most hardened criminals

The police attended at the time and i got a crime number, but there was no forensic work done and no photos taken by the police.

Anyway, more to the point, i contacted the insurer reported the attempted break in and the offered to arrange someone to make the house secure. I'd already fixed the door frame back into the brick work and screwed the door shut so i declined and told them i'd already got someone lined up to replace the door frame. They asked for the quote, and then immediately agreed to pay the bill when the work was done.

Simple as that.

I'd make the claim, be honest, and explain you don't know how they got in. I'm sure you're confident the door was locked, so tell them that. I wouldn't fake damage. That would be blatant fraud.

 

[mikehammer69]

I had a few thousand pound worth of fishing tackle stolen from my shed about 30 years ago. I reported it to the police, they never came round, just gave me a crime number via a letter about a week later, it was headed " Dear Victim", lovely. Insurance sent a loss adjuster round, I said it was pointless as there was nothing to see- it had gone! They insisted. When he turned up I showed him where the shed was, he said he's not there for that, he just wanted to check all my doors and windows had locks on, as per the policy, as if there was any discrepancy they wouldn' have paid a penny. Luckily all was OK, and i eventually got weighed out.

Yes .

You're saying that the shed was robbed but they were checking the house doors and windows to ensure compliancewith t+c 's ?

If not the policy was void and no payout

In the meantime insurance will happily take a non-complaint policyholders money until a claim arises . Easy money.

 

[mikehammer69]

We had an attempted break in last year. The thieves tried to lever the door frame out of the brick work. Thankfully (or not) we were in so the ran off when i turned the lights on and they saw me in the kitchen in my PJ's brandishing my son's hockey stick. Enough to scare even the most hardened criminals

The police attended at the time and i got a crime number, but there was no forensic work done and no photos taken by the police.

Anyway, more to the point, i contacted the insurer reported the attempted break in and the offered to arrange someone to make the house secure. I'd already fixed the door frame back into the brick work and screwed the door shut so i declined and told them i'd already got someone lined up to replace the door frame. They asked for the quote, and then immediately agreed to pay the bill when the work was done.

Simple as that.

I'd make the claim, be honest, and explain you don't know how they got in. I'm sure you're confident the door was locked, so tell them that. I wouldn't fake damage. That would be blatant fraud.

Yes that seems to be clearer now to me.

Rather than faking a break-in it's better to say the doors were locked and you don't know how they got in