Leaking JG speed fit elbow

[Jupiter01]

I have one of these in the ceiling and it joins to copper and plastic in 22mm. It was seeping through the ceiling around 4 years ago. I cut the ceiling and tightened the joins. The leak stopped.

It happened again this week. Again, I tightened it and it stopped. It was quite loose.

I was trying to find some writing on the plastic pipe to see what make it is but couldn’t find anything.

Any suggestions on how I should address this please?

 

[muggles]

Change the fitting for a new one

 

[oldbutnotdead]

And make sure there's an insert in the plastic. Also check the copper very carefully for dents, burrs, that sort of thing

 

[Jupiter01]

I was wondering if the pipe and elbow may be incompatible but as I say, can’t identify the type of pipe that is used. I would prefer a hep20 fitting.

 

[oldbutnotdead]

22mm is 22mm. The critical bit with placcie is the insert- the internal bore of different brands of placcie varies so mixing brands or even product lines of tube and insert is very very unwise. I found this by accident with some noname 15mm- used a JG insert by mistake, seemed to fit, no leaks but coupler popped off after 6 months (lucky I was home that day). Found my error, used the correct insert, it's been fine since.

 

[Jupiter01]

Ok…
If it does have an insert, how can I be sure it’s the right one for that pipe?

 

[oldbutnotdead]

Ok…
If it does have an insert, how can I be sure it’s the right one for that pipe?

With difficulty. Does the placcie have a brand/range name printed on it (usually does). If so then go and buy an insert for that brand/range while you're out shopping for the new 22mm fitting.
And when you assemble the joint, make sure the pipes go all the way in (if in any doubt, measure the internal depth of the fitting then mark both tubes with a Sharpie or similar at the measured depth- include the thickness of the insert head in the measurement on the placcie side).

 

[Jupiter01]

There's no name on the pipe. Here is a picture of the pipe and joint in question.

 

[SandyLyon]

Replace the fitting, make sure the copper pipe has been cut with a pipe slice or similar that puts a bevel on the end of the tube (square cuts with a hacksaw can leave sharp burrs that can damage the “O” ring and cause leaks) make sure there is no damage to the copper where the “O” ring sits.

Make sure the plastic pipe has an insert fitted and that the pipe has no score marks or damage where the “O” ring sits.

Finally make sure both pipes are pushed in full socket.

Edit. You say that you have tightened the fittings, they don’t need tightening by turning the “nut” it locks the collet to prevent it undoing. Also are you sure that the fitting is leaking and not above it and running down.

 

[Jupiter01]

Edit. You say that you have tightened the fittings, they don’t need tightening by turning the “nut” it locks the collet to prevent it undoing. Also are you sure that the fitting is leaking and not above it and running down.

Very interesting.
Excuse my ignorance, I have only ever used Hep20 when it comes to plastic.

The leak was definitely on this join (the copper end to be specific) and it was significant. It has now completely stopped. When I opened up the ceiling and saw the drip from that join, I tightened that nut and it stopped immediately. I recall doing the same around 4 years ago, as I explained earlier.

Would welcome your comment on this.

 

[denso13]

Would welcome your comment on this.

As said, tightening does nothing to effect a better seal, it's only a security measure to prevent the elbow coming off.

 

[Jupiter01]

As said, tightening does nothing to effect a better seal, it's only a security measure to prevent the elbow coming off.

Understood.
Is there any explanation for why the dripping immediately stopped when I tightened this?
Perhaps I inadvertently pushed the joint on to the copper tube and that’s what actually stopped it…

 

[SandyLyon]

Understood.
Is there any explanation for why the dripping immediately stopped when I tightened this?
Perhaps I inadvertently pushed the joint on to the copper tube and that’s what actually stopped it…

The main reasons for a weep / leak on the copper side of the fitting would likely be.

”O” ring damaged, perhaps “nicked” when copper tube was pushed into the fitting. Can happen if pipe cut with hacksaw.
”O” ring sitting on area of damaged copper tube, dent, scratch, solder etc.
”O” ring has swarf or dirt trapped in between it and the pipe. By pushing and twisting the pipe or may have dislodged it.
Pipe not pushed in full socket.

Personally I would, drain down, remove and discard fitting, inspect pipe, clean or replace pipe and install new fitting.

 

[oldbutnotdead]

There's no name on the pipe. Here is a picture of the pipe and joint in question.

View attachment 292825

Annoying. But if it's the copper end that's leaking, maybe a non-issue.
Looking at that pic the joint appears strained- as if there's tension on it which isn't desirable. It's not a brilliant idea to have any pressure on the collet (on the left the collet appears to be hard against the wall which might imply that the copper is not all the way into the fitting).
About all you can do is drain down, remove fitting, inspect pipes, replace with new fitting - check for insertion depth as mentioned previously.
JG do sell collars (which prevent any external pressure on the collet).

 

[terryplumb]

Has the copper pipe come loose in the fitting more than once ?
If so check it's diameter ,it may be 3/4 in and not 22 mm ,is it an old property ?