Lighting loops not working since changing kitchen lights

[fattybatter86]

Hello,

A newbie here, and one who should probably know better than to touch electrics!

I have just upgraded my 2 kitchen ceiling rose lights to 2 triple spot lights. Unfortunately I did not make a drawing of how the wires were laid out when I took the ceiling roses off so I have got in a muddle.

The 2 lights have changed from old style ceiling roses to spot lights and the connections are completely different.

I have wired it as below (sorry for the poor sketch but it was done in haste in paint)

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• fattybatter86
• 29 Dec 2012
• 1

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• fattybatter86
• 29 Dec 2012
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• fattybatter86
• 29 Dec 2012
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• fattybatter86
• 29 Dec 2012
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• fattybatter86
• 29 Dec 2012
• 1

The problem I am having is when wired up and power switched on the 2 new kitchen lights are very bright and also hot, not sure if that is right and also now if the kitchen lights are on the upstairs lights will not work and when the kitchen lights are of the upstairs lights are very dim, even more so when more than one is on.

I am really struggling to see where I can make a change to the circuit and was hoping that someone who knew what they were doing would have an idea as to how this should be wired? I am struggling to see past the fact there is no red (live) wire connecting the lights.

If you want any further information or have any questions please ask as I know my pics, drawing and explanation are not very technical.

Cheers

Matt

 

[ericmark]

Clearly L2 will not work as no neutral there is normally no neutral going to the switch and one of the black wires going to switch will be line not neutral.

There are diagrams in Wiki have a look.

This

is a general wiring diagram.

 

[securespark]

You seem to have something in series, as the other lights are dim.

You need a multimeter. You need to check which wires are which. There are live wires that are live all the time (loop) which are connected to each other but not to anything else, there are live wires that are only live when the switch is or switches are closed which are connected only to the live of the fitting, and there are neutrals only connected to N.

Your pictures unfortunately are not pinsharp, but it looks like you have connected a switchwire to the loop, which may be a mistake. Also, I cannot make out what is going on at the switch. It looks like only one switch will work, given the connections in the photo.

Also, your paint diagram shows 3 wires at the second fitting, but the photo seems to show more. The paint diagram shows two switchwires at the second fitting. If this is the case, it is wrong.

 

[fattybatter86]

Morning Gents,

Thank you for the reply's. Sorry about the pic quality, they were taken fairly late last night so no lights were available.

Here are a couple more taken in today's light.

The switch.....

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• fattybatter86
• 30 Dec 2012
• 1

Then light 1 which has all the wires in....

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• fattybatter86
• 30 Dec 2012
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then light 2 which only has a black and earth then a separate red wire back to the plug...

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• fattybatter86
• 30 Dec 2012
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Here is a pic of how they look in the room

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• fattybatter86
• 30 Dec 2012
• 1

It seems the issue is not with the second light but with the main wiring. When i wire the light in as per instruction, ie all reds together, all earths together, switched live into light live then rest of black wires together in the neutral connector, I can turn the kitchen lights on. But if they are on then upstairs will not come on. If the kitchen light is of then upstairs will come on?

does that make sense?

 

[fattybatter86]

One really simple question, should the switched live be live all the time or only when the switch is on?

 

[fattybatter86]

Oh well, All done now.

It turned out my so called ex electrician step dad couldn't work out what a switched live was and actually told me the live feed was the switched live.

Got that all sorted so all of the lights work up and down stairs, then the second light cannot be switched on or off, no matter how we connect them up no joy.

I repeatedly say it must be the wires in the switch (2 gang) but he says that they can't be wrong as he put them back exactly how they were. Obviously not as I change the wires in the switch round and low and behold they work perfectly.

Lessons learnt over the past few days....

1. Always label, sketch and photo anything before you take it apart.

2. Do not call step dad over who thinks he can do house electrics.

Cheers all for you help.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Lessons learnt over the past few days....

1. Always label, sketch and photo anything before you take it apart.

2. Do not call step dad over who thinks he can do house electrics.

3. Get a multimeter and learn how to use it.

4. Learn how lighting circuits work.

 

[securespark]

Yup, the second switch only had a feed to the common and nothing on the outgoing terminals. The first switch had both switchwires in L1 and L2....

Glad it's all sorted.