Line of Sight Bricks

[topgazza]

Set in the ground across the front of my garden about 10 foot in from the road and across next doors is a line of bricks set in the ground. Our houses are on a small estate and on the inside of a long bend and it was explained by a council highways man that the bricks mark the "line of sight" for cars coming round the bend and residents aren't allowed to have high hedges or fences blocking the view. next door want to extend the area outside their front to the side past the line of bricks and park their car there.

This doesn't bother me and I'm trying to help them by finding out the rules. My deeds are vague and don't mention paving past the bricks even though the land belongs to the house owner and using it as a parking area. We have both written to the local council for advice but they are very slow of of course, in replying so any pointers would be appreciated

 

[wessex101]

Probably would have been imposed on the original planning application when the houses were built.

 

[topgazza]

Thanks and that is likely the case. I'm going to re read my deeds for this area and see if there are any convenents about , effectively blocking the line of sight with cars parked on the owners land outside the line of sight markers. Let alone paving the area.

 

[topgazza]

Only reply I have had from development control was to ask for a fee of £47.40 to address my planning enquiry

Sorry but I think a simple question as to the purpose of the markers and could anyone park the road side of them doesn't constitute a planning enquiry. Jeez, I know times are tight but .....

Just asked them again pointing out its not a planning enquiry but just a simple what do the markers imply and forbid/allow question....

Or should I be directing my question at the county council roads dept ? But just looking for what the markers mean and are there any enforcible actions if they are abused

 

[wessex101]

If the land is within the visibility splay I doubt your neighbour would get permission to form a parking space.

However it depends on a lot of factors such as is the road "designated". A very secretive position that none of the Councils around me will declare in the public domain. Clues are...is it on a bus route? Does the road get gritted in the winter etc.

Most likely you'll have to cough up the cash if they want any answers. You didn't think they were providing a public service that you already pay for through your Council Tax did you?

 

[topgazza]

I know... I'm so naive to think that Next you'll be telling me there's no Santa.......

Its not on a bus route and doesn't get gritted as far as I know as its a local small estate road off any main roads. But I suspect laying a parking slab and parking cars on it would be rejected as its a long sweeping bend. Not fast moving traffic as it's only locals to the estate and delivery drivers...the usual. It's years ago now but we had a kerb problem and the local council guy came out and was tutting about a hedge in the visibility splay and "warned" that it was getting too high which was my first indication about what the marked area meant. To be honest I'd never even thought about it until he mentioned it.

But thanks, I'll suggest my neighbour at least enquires before undertaking any work to make sure he is within planning regs

 

[wessex101]

The modern trend, bizarrely, is to reduce visibility to try and slow traffic down. If it is just a bend and not a junction the policy might have changed making the visibility splay less important, especially if it is just an estate road.

 

[topgazza]

Good point. I'll still advise him to see if he needs permission to either pave it or park his car there. Just so he's covered.

Thanks for your advice

 

[^woody^]

The presence of the bricks is irrelevant to any "sight line" position, so can be ignored.

Any planning application today will need to confirm to the current planning policy, and as part of the assessment the views of the highways department may be sought. They in turn will assess the proposal in accordance with current government guidance on visibility, but IIRC, sight lines and visibility splays only apply to the likes of driveways and junctions where vehicles need to pull out across footpaths or into traffic, and not to bends in the road.

 

[topgazza]

The sight line cuts across two driveways and is our exit onto the estate road across dropped kerbs. Apart from us pulling out into the road the council guy a few years said it was also intended to give cars driving around the curve in the road clear site of any oncoming cars.There is a , cul de sac, junction/exit on the other side of the road so not directly affected as they have clear view anyway

 

[topgazza]

This is what it looks like

Red is the marked "line of sight"
Black are the driveways and blue is where he is considering as a parking area. According to the plans he owns that area...

Remembering this is not a main road but an estate road

 

[^woody^]

I would question that council guy's knowledge of, well his job really. He may have just made it all up.

If it's private land, the owner could potentially plant the highest bushiest tree there and there would by no law to stop him.

 

[topgazza]

But woody if that was the case wouldn't that make the visibility line worthless and could be ignored by anyone at anytime, anywhere ? Surely the whole principal is that there is a clear line of site as designated by those markers ? Happy to be corrected of course


Looking at my deeds the red line is in fact dotted which is a boundary on the plan so they don't own that part but the council does unless its some sort of joint ownership. I called the council because the kerb drop was in that area. I'm beginning to suspect as I say that they don't actually own that land as they seem to think. Although the previous owners paid the council to cut the grass along that area to the side so I'm not sure now.Weird

 

[Diver Fred]

Speaking from experience here...

Find the original conveyance document (may be entitled 'Deeds) for your property. The building society will probably hold it if you haven't paid your mortage off, if you have then the BS will have sent them to you. Otherwise contact the solicitor who dealt with the purchase as he may hold them. Clause 4 (section?) will detail (parking) restrictions; the document will also contain a plan of the property which includes boundary responsibilities. Your plot will be outlined in Red. The plan will be signed by 3 people, a developer representive, a council rep and the initial purchaser. Your plot may only go to the line of bricks which you are questioning, the remainder of the land which you maintain thinking you own it may be public (councils) land.
Electronic land registry doc's may(?) not (more likely will not) be accurate.

I can only repeat you need the original conveyance document, any document issued post that may and quite probably is wrong.

 

[^woody^]

My deeds are vague and don't mention paving past the bricks even though the land belongs to the house owner

Looking at my deeds the red line is in fact dotted which is a boundary on the plan so they don't own that part but the council does unless its some sort of joint ownership.

Which is it. Who owns what?