Loft Conversion Planning help

[TatskyPT]

Hi All

I am in the very early stages of planning a loft conversion.

I am pretty experienced with building work/DIY so intend to get a builder to do the structural work, steels, stairs, velux windows, and I can complete the rest. Have 2 friend sparkies, 2 chippies and a plumber so OK for trades at mates rates.

Anyway, I am trying to work out in my head how the steels will go in. I will be getting plans drawn up, and speaking to BCO but I like to have an plan in my head before I get people in, just for my peace of mind.

My loft is great for conversion. Head room is 3m at center, with room for me to stand up in a huge part of the area.

Also, the house is an old terrace, Rafter and Purlin design so not much to remove.

My main issue is there is a King Post in the center of the loft, with a horizontal tie beam running from front to back of the house. Spars come from this to purlins supporting rafters.

I will need to put steels from side to side (party wall), but this Tie Beam in the center is 9inches deep. The steels will have to be above that, making my floor 9 inches above the ceiling.

I don't think I can remove the tie beam and spars, because there would be nothing to support the roof in the meantime. i.e. I need the steels in to take the load, so I can remove the purlins/spars/kingpost. But the Tie Beam is in the way of the Steel.

Any ideas?

I wondered if I could position steels front to back, either side of the Tie Beam, and hang joists from the steel and hangers on the party wall?

Here are images of my loft on Flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/53203458@N06/4911102224/in/photostream/#/

Dimensions are:

King Post - 3m from Tie beam to Ridge
Tie Beam - 8.4m
Span from Wall to Tie Beam 2.7m


Cheers

Paul

 

[marsaday]

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You are doing exactly what i am doing at the moment. I have the steels in the back garden now and am just waiting for my mate to crane them in in 2 weeks time. i have cut my hole in the front of the house as well.

What the engineer has done for me is use the tie beam as part of the floor construction and reinforce it both sides with a C channel.

The king post stays and i will just cut the 2 diagonal props and create 2 doorways on each side. I will then use steel plates bolted both sides of the kingpost frame to strengthen where these diagonals have been cut. In total there are 26 plates.

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[TatskyPT]

WOW

I have been trawling websites looking for photos of lofts just like mine. That looks Identical.

So are you going to hand joists between the C Channels either side of the tie beam and the party walls?

Are you using joist hangers directly on the wall, or are you going to fix a timber to the wall and hang joists off that?

How are you going to incorporate the King post into the rooms? Actually just noticed you say you will have doors each side. So will these be seperate rooms? Are you building a dorma? I am just looking to install roof lights as the space is pretty big and will be used for a bedroom and ensuite.

Was it an option to remove the King Post and put a steel to support the ridge?

1 last question I think. Are your steels in sections (i.e. bolt together when you get them up there, or are they 1 peice? I know the structural engineer can calculate for either.

Oh, and are you doing a lot of the work yourself?

Cheers.

Great to speak to someone who is doing the same thing.

 

[marsaday]

yes, quite funny we are doing the same thing.

yes joists will be hung from the C channels with a 8x3" joist bolted into each C channel. The party and gable wall will then be used to hang off.

I am going to use a timber wall plate as most people say this is a better solution than individual wall hangers in the wall. I will use a resin system to glue the bolts into the wall which will hold the WP

The steels are 8.62m long and could have been in sections, but would have been much bigger.

The room is 8.4m x 6.5m and is divided perfectly by the kingpost. So it isnt in the way as we would put a wall in its place anyway. Half the area becomes a bedroom and a quarter becomes a bathroom and walk in wardrobe on the way to the bathroom. The last quarter is the landing.

If the kingpost wasnt there we could have used 1.2m into the quarter where the stairs come up, but this is no big deal. This will either be made into a storage room or left as a bigger landing.

To the right of the kingpost will be the door into the bedroom. to the left will be a door into the wardrobe and bathroom.

I am doing all the work myself except getting my mate to help put the steels in (he has a crane) and having the stairs made.

I have just fitted a new window in the gable end for the bathroom and 5 velux's.

So we have full light in there now and i am just preparing the padstones for the beams.

 

[TatskyPT]

I've got you, so the King post becomes the juntion between the 2 doors, or at least the 2 walls with the doors in.

Sounds like your space is the same size as ours.

I meant to ask previously, if the structs are being removed, are you also removing the purlins and then supporting the rafters on a knee wall or similar?

I couldn't be really cheeky and ask if you have a copy of your plans in electronic format I could take a butchers at? or even just a sketch?

I am one of these people who needs to understand the whole process, even if I am getting someone in to do the steels I need to know exactly what needs to be done so I know i'm not getting the wool pulled.

How long to you rekon it will take to finish your conversion? We are converting because the wife is pregnant, and we need the room. Baby is due in January, so as long as the messy stuff is done by then, I have 3-4 months to complete the job whilst the bairn is in our bedroom.

So all in all I have until March/April next year to complete. I think that is fair as a DIYer.

 

[marsaday]

Whats your email. I can send you a drawing of the truss structure cut and bolted. you may want to use my engineer as he could just use my plans (possibly) and would need one inspection. he is based in leeds, but would travel i reckon. he is a good bloke and was quite cheap at £400.

The struts stay, but are modified. you will understand when you see the drawing, but you have the king post and either side of this you have a new door frame created. This is where you cut out the diagonal strut (width of a door).

Then you have a new piece of strong timber either side of the door. The strut continues from this point into where is sits. So you leave one end and reduce down the other side. However, this will now not be as strong as the current set up, so you plate everything and this makes it stronger than present.

Loft conversions take about 12 weeks if a builder does one. So imagine 2 men on site for 12 weeks. however they may not be there every day.

I am not in a rush, but like you hope to have kids, but i think i will finish before that happens. So the steels go in first week sep and then i can build my floor. if i work on it full time i can finish it in 4 mths i reckon. Although i am not fully sure how long it will take.

 

[TatskyPT]

Champion, cheers mate.

My email ****REMOVED****

I am based in Gateshead, so not a million miles away.

I see what you mean about the struts, ie relocating them to get the door in. Sounds like a good solution to keep the integrity of the structure, but make a clear route through.

I am being very generous with the time I have as with working full time, and any other jobs the missus throws my way, my available time might be stretched. If I can get the structure done by christmas I will be a happy man.

Did you fit your roof lights/windows yourself? And did you need planning permission for that number?

 

[marsaday]

roof windows and gable window i did myself and didnt need PP. Just building control regs and it comes under the blanket of my attic conversion and cost £400. email sent.

 

[TatskyPT]

That's excellent mate, cheers.

You have been a massive help. I will keep you posted on how I get on. First task is speaking to BC to get them on board, and also going to speak to an estate agent to get an idea of value we can add to the house.

As there is no planning permission due to no major work on roof like dorma etc, is it pretty quick to kick off the BC process?

Then I need to work out a list of costs. I have a mate who is a branch manager of a builders merchants, which will come in handy. And my father in law works at a fabrication place, so can get my steels cut and pre drilled there.

Oh one other thing, sorry As you aren't inserting steels into the party wall, is there no party wall to consider? The wall plate will be on your side, so not sure how that affects party wall. Actually, I guess as it's putting weight on the wall Party Wall still applies.

We are a mid terrace, so probably just 3 roof windows for us (2 same height, and one lower one as the fire escape).


Anyway, thanks again. Drop me a line when you get your steels in and let me know how it went.

Cheers

Paul

 

[marsaday]

You still do a PWA because you are taking loadings off these walls.

BCN is pretty straight forward and quick.

Good luck

 

[TatskyPT]

Hi Mate

I noticed on another post you said that your big truss was resting on rimber on the wall? I have been clearing our my loft ready for the guy coming next week to draw up plans etc, and I checked out my situation.

My truss is also sitting on timber.

What did you do in the end? Did you cut the timber out from either side of the truss to place the pad stone, or did you remove the timber from under the truss also?

Cheers

 

[peter8todd]

Hi there, I also live in Gateshead and picked up an old post where you were planning a loft conversion.

I am als o struggling with understanding how the king post can be removed. Did you complete your project and if so do you have any drawings that you would be able to share of the structural modifications that you made that would help me get my head around the principles.

 

[Nicholas m]

Hi guys I know this is an old thread but I'm having my loft converted and I'm in the same situation, does anyone have any photos of their finished project please.