Moving a pull light switch in the bathroom

[adm]

Anyone with any ideas on the following, I need to move the pull light switch in the bathroom to accommodate a new cupboard I am building but having removed the switch cover there is very little wire coming out of the ceiling,as the ceiling is not accessible from above what is the best way to extend the wire so I can move the switch by about 2 foot. The switch operates a 5 foot strip light and only has two red wires going into the pull light switch.

 

[333rocky333]

Is the same wire found in the strip light, is it possible to forget that cable and run a new cable from the striplight to the new switch position

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

If it is two single reds (rather than twined sheathed), then it is probably going to require maintenance free jointing and extending.
It really depends on how the circuit is configured, routed and where the pull cord is to be relocated in relationship to the existing cable routes.

Very likely, if no access from above, then you would need to chop into the ceiling, to access cables and route them in compliance to regulations.
And there would also be considerations of the requirement for RCD protection.

 

[ericmark]

I would say alter the new cupboard to accommodate the light switch. It seems no earth so wiring before 1966 so to alter means new cables and RCD protection which will be expensive, so leave well alone.

There is nothing to say existing wiring should be updated, but as soon as you add any new wires they must comply with current regulations, so to comply it would be expensive.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

only has two red wires going into the pull light switch.

No earth?

Do the cables run in metal conduit, by any chance?

 

[adm]

The cables do not run in metal conduit, having removed the cover from the strip light there is a live and neutral wire in red and black going up into the ceiling void which is not accessible and as I have said only two red wires going into the pull light switch mechanism. This strip light was installed before we moved into the house and this is the first time I have needed to look into the wiring on this light fitting. All the other light fittings and switches do have earths installed.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I fear that you are going to have to find a way to make the ceiling void accessible.

 

[adm]

Thanks for the replies if I can somehow gain access to the ceiling void then what do you suggest.

 

[eveares]

but as soon as you add any new wires they must comply with current regulations

I am curious, how do you handle situations where a customer wants a light switch moved on a circuit what has no CPC at all and does not want the whole circuit rewired?

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

The cables do not run in metal conduit, having removed the cover from the strip light there is a live and neutral wire in red and black going up into the ceiling void which is not accessible and as I have said only two red wires going into the pull light switch mechanism. This strip light was installed before we moved into the house and this is the first time I have needed to look into the wiring on this light fitting. All the other light fittings and switches do have earths installed.

Have you checked if there is an earth core in either the live or neutral sheaths?

 

[ericmark]

I am curious, how do you handle situations where a customer wants a light switch moved on a circuit what has no CPC at all and does not want the whole circuit rewired?

You say no sorry not permitted to do it, if a scheme member, as the scheme requires you to follow BS7671, if not a scheme member, then it's down to you, BS7671 is not law, the only law is Part P building regulations which although they say one way to comply is to follow BS7671 do allow you to do things like fit German sockets. If the work needs notifying then down to LABC.

I look at it this way, since 1966 the premises should have been inspected many times, including every time a new occupant moves in. As the occupant you should know if there is no earth on the lights, and you should realise until corrected your stumped as far as alterations go.

I had this with my mothers house, wiring was in a state, but dad was adamant I am not living in a building site, which was fair comment, so would not permit a rewire, so when we wanted the kitchen redoing to allow my disabled mother to use it, we had to bring a SWA cable around the outside of the house and install a consumer unit in the kitchen to supply everything in the kitchen, ceiling removed and all plaster off the the walls and kitchen electrics are independent to rest of the house.

When I thought I may need to rent the house, then I got the house rewired. By that time my father was dead, so it was down to me.

 

[EFLImpudence]

You say no sorry not permitted to do it, if a scheme member, as the scheme requires you to follow BS7671,

I would just say that if the work is not notifiable, as in this example, then it is nothing to do with the schemes nor LABC.

if not a scheme member, then it's down to you, BS7671 is not law, the only law is Part P building regulations which although they say one way to comply is to follow BS7671

Part P says nothing about that. It just says:

Following BS7671 may be the accepted way of complying with that.

 

[ericmark]

Since I am not a scheme member I have not read the agreement between the scheme operator and member, I was lead to understand the member enters a contract with the operator to say they will follow BS7671 if so then members must do that, they are legally obliged to, however if the scheme operator does not require members to follow BS7671 then it is up to the member if he follows BS7671 or not.

Remember BS7671 has never permitted lights without an earth, wiring regulations have, but the wiring regulations were not BS7671 pre 1966 when they allowed it.

Common sense may tell you it is no worse after moving the switch than before, the question is are we following common sense or the wiring regulations? Once we decide we are using the common sense approach then you may as well put the regulations in the bin.

There are cases where I think the regulations were wrong, I say were as I don't have amendment 3 and it could have changed, but having cables buried in the wall RCD protected if those cables carry a SELV supply seems crazy, to my mind there has never been a need for RCD protection of 8 volt door bell wires. However in the regulations it does not state low voltage or reduced low voltage or any other voltage we just assume it is referring to low voltage.

However when it is so clear the RCD protection could never be applied to ELV it is rather easy to use common sense, but once we say "It's OK to break the rules here." when do we stop.

 

[bernardgreen]

Part P says nothing about that. It just says:

It makes no mention of protecting property from fire nor does it mention protecting a person who is in the property but is not operating any switches or any other part of the installation. It seems to suggest that injury from touching a switch is acceptable but injury from operating the same switch is not acceptable.

To me this is one reason why common sense and knowledge of hazards is more effective in protecting people and property than a book of bad written rules and guidelines.

 

[securespark]

It sounds like the property is a flat or maisonette wired pre 14th Edition.

Or it could be post 14th, which could mean if there is only two red conductors at the switch position, the cpc is via metallic conduit.

We need photos of where the cables come into the flu fitting and how the flu fitting is attached to the ceiling.