New indust. unit Key areas to think about for the customer

[oharaf]

A customer i have worked for for a while now has recently moved units.

The new unit has no electrical supplies, his requirements are 3 phase and single phase.

3 phase will include a forklift charger, Milling machine, 2 Welders a metal saw and eventually a punch down press.

i need to advise him on what & how the installation should develop.

I've been working through a list so far.

1.

3 phase Dis board, there is one there already, he has one from the old unit, both are 'of an age' but theoretically could provide enough circuits , if it is possible to source the parts. This would mean creating a sub-main or 2 possibly

2. The Miller and Saw will be in a permanent setting so, if i am correct, should have emergency stop switches all interlinked, when the punch down press arrives this should also be linked in.

3. The welders are partially portable, on wheels, with C form connectors and so I would invisage having several 400v plugs in appropriate places, but, what would be the requirement for emergency stop in these cases??

4. There will also be a requirement for 110v supply points this i see no problem with as they can be fixed sockets in places he requires, taking obvious limits into consideration.

5. The permanently fixed equipment will require clear passage around it in order to carryout servicing and cleaning.

Cost is going to be a serious factor, i think this environment would be better suited to using SWA, however trunking and singles would provide greater flexibility.

I do not think he has given any thought to EAWR, HASWA, PEWUR etc and i am not sure how much he knows about them. Is there any place i could point him toward for advice? I am happy to do the work but I want it to be correct as any injury or fatality due to lack of a well planned install would refelect badly on me.

He is one of those people who jumps in and then changes his mind and does not then want to foot the extra cost.

I have asked him to sit down and decide exactly what he wants and where so I can at least begin to work on some costing.

I would really value any input from you guys particularly you who work in the industrial environment

 

[EdwardCurrent]

Hi Oharaf.
All your answers are in the red book as you know, you will need to be confident that they are the minimum requirements for your 'particular' installation. I think you already knew that though . (thats where your answers are).
By the sounds of it I would want written confirmation re drawings re price etc.
Not the best way to start a job I know.

Ed

 

[333rocky333]

One option is run all the plant via its own 3 phase board.
Feed the board via a large contacter with its control circuit wired through all the e stops.

 

[holmslaw]

..

 

[Spark123]

Also provide some 32A 110v sockets as you can guarentee they will want to use a grinder at some point!

 

[mikhailfaradayski]

I would urge the customer to have a risk assessment (or at least a consultation) carried out and then form a plan around that. If you wish to give advice on safety issues, i would check that your insurance is adequate (1/4 mil PI might not be enough for this)

There are more elements to workplace safety than just the electrical aspect, the customer would benefit from a safety dude offering qualified advice. (try searching for Nebosh or Iosh) I think this would also limit your liability if you are installing just to regs, not advising.

I see no immeadiate reason why an emergency condition on one machine should stop all machines. The only times i have seen that is in a school workshop or where the machines are not independant ( maybe form a process line from a combination of machines)

I don't see a need for an emergency stop for a hand-held weld set (robot welder, yes)

Depends on the layout of the workshop and how likely it is to change in the future, but galv trunking and singles would allow change with less fuss then SWA everywhere. Maybe SWA/SY or conduits for dropping out the trunk down walls etc.

 

[oharaf]

Spoke to customer yesterday, he is getting a chap from HSE to come in and advise. I have arranged for a specialist industrial sparks to come.

The good news is the customer had drawn up a plan for all the plant!! Hurrah.

I will be overseeing (and getting some experiene with the industrial guys to boot). I am then going to remodel the office area

 

[ColJack]

generalised e-stops are a bad idea..

each machine should be fitted with suitable guards and whatever other means are needed to prevent personal injury, but this is down to the machine installers.. ( presumably as he's moving, they already have light guards etc installed )

having a general e-stop could also be dangerous.. stopping a miller mid cut for example will damage the tool, workpiece ( sending bits of shrapnel in all directions ) and even possibly the machine itself, so should only be shut down if IT is in trouble, not because another machine gives rise to danger..

but as said, a risk assesment would need to be done to determine the best cause of action..

as for the 110V grinders, they work perfectly well in a 16A socket, even the 9 inch ones..

for the cost savings, it's not worth trying to bodge it with the old boards as quite likely they're obsolete now and you'll struggle to find parts anyway..

don't forget one or two general socket circuits too.. there's bound to be some radio's and so on that the guys will want to plug in..

 

[mikhailfaradayski]

......(sending bits of shrapnel in all directions)....

i would hope not, could be messy