New shower cable

[ColJack]

can you do us a photo of the fuseboard? we like such things and it would help to clear up a few things..

 

[ban-all-sheds]

421.3?
421.6?

would either of these cover it?

Either of those could well prevent you from installing a wooden-backed CU.

Now show me one which prevents you adding a circuit to one that happens to already be installed.

 

[VanSolo]

Looking at various suppliers, I think a 10mm diameter cable for that length should cost about £25. The difficulty is going to be running the cable so it might take a couple or 3 hours. I'd have thought £75 should cover the labour.

You will also need a new 45A pull cord switch as the one you have now will probably be burned inside. That's what the fishy smell is.

 

[securespark]

(i.e. when 2 or 3 people use the shower back-to-back) we start to get this odd fishy smell.

Either, shower on your own, or be more careful with whom you share with.

 

[securespark]

421.3?
421.6?

would either of these cover it?

Either of those could well prevent you from installing a wooden-backed CU.

Now show me one which prevents you adding a circuit to one that happens to already be installed.

I can't. However, I had a discussion today with Wylex having found a shower installation done in July 2008.

9.5kW shower fed from existing 6 way Wylex board through a 30A 1361. No RCD. No PEB's.

Wylex (I phoned to confirm it in front of the customer) told me the 6 way boards are rated at 60A and should not have any circuits >32A fed from them. So that would prevent you from adding a >32A circuit to such a board.

 

[securespark]

after prolonged use (i.e. when 2 or 3 people use the shower back-to-back) we start to get this odd fishy smell.

30A fuses can only withstand a certain overload for a short length of time.

The longer the shower is on, the closer to rupture the fuse will get. And obviously, the longer the shower is on the warmer any loose connections (which may be present) will get, thus heating up surrounding materials.

The shower I mentioned previously had worked from July 2008 until this morning, when the 30A 1361 fuse gave up the fight.

This was because of the continued overload (11.3A) on that fuse weakening it until it finally ruptured.

 

[Zambezi]

I went and had a look at a Triton shower (8.5KW or 9.5KW) the other day, landlord said it was sparking then went cold.
The can assembly (the bit with the heating elements in it) popped, the shower was a mess inside, melted terminals and insulation etc. Old Wylex board, 30A fuse, no RCD, no supplementary bonding, protective bonding not connected to the water main.
Scary thing is that the fuse did not blow I would not be surprised if there is a nail in the fuse carrier or they have connected the shower directly to the isolator somehow! I have to go back to do some other work so I will investigate further.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Wylex (I phoned to confirm it in front of the customer) told me the 6 way boards are rated at 60A and should not have any circuits >32A fed from them. So that would prevent you from adding a >32A circuit to such a board.

Yes - that's fair enough.

It was this blanket "can't add new circuits" view that I was challenging:

as your fuse board is made of a flammable material no new circuits can be taken from that board as it does not meet current regulations.

 

[Taylortwocities]

we start to get this odd fishy smell

That is characteristic smell of PVC cable overheating. This usually caused by the cable being overloaded and/or terminations being loose. Both of these cause the conductor to heat up and the insulation then melts. After a while the cable may catch fire.

It is my opinion that you should stop using the shower and have the problem looked at. Either that or move the family and all of your valuables some distance from the house.

 

[ColJack]

422.4.3 and 422.4.4?

or 421.7 which re-directs you to 526.5 and may I draw you attention to part (iii) of the same..

526.5 - Every termination and jointin a live of PEN conductor shall be made within one of thefollowing or a combination thereof:

(i) A suitable accessory complying with the appropriate product standard
(ii) An equipment enclosure complying with the appropriate product standard
(iii) An enclosure partially formed or completed with building material which is non-combustible when tested to BS476-4

 

[skenk]

I went and had a look at a Triton shower (8.5KW or 9.5KW) the other day, 30A fuse,
Scary thing is that the fuse did not blow I would not be surprised if there is a nail in the fuse carrier or they have connected the shower directly to the isolator somehow! I have to go back to do some other work so I will investigate further.

Zambezi if you are working as a spark you should probably know that fuses do not blow at (anywhere near) their rated current. Especially if the load is only for a short time (like in electric showers). Have a look at the tables in appendix 3.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

That is characteristic smell of PVC cable overheating.

No - it's the characteristic smell of overheated Bakelite, which will be present in the body of the switch, the Wylex etc.

Agree with everything else you say though.

 

[ColJack]

skenk, you really in france?...

you must be, who would lie about being in france if they didn't have to...

and BAS? no thoughts on my post above?

 

[333rocky333]

I went and had a look at a Triton shower (8.5KW or 9.5KW) the other day, 30A fuse,
Scary thing is that the fuse did not blow I would not be surprised if there is a nail in the fuse carrier or they have connected the shower directly to the isolator somehow! I have to go back to do some other work so I will investigate further.

Zambezi if you are working as a spark you should probably know that fuses do not blow at (anywhere near) their rated current. Especially if the load is only for a short time (like in electric showers). Have a look at the tables in appendix 3.

Maybe he was refering to this that should have blown the fuse

landlord said it was sparking then went cold.
The can assembly (the bit with the heating elements in it) popped, the shower was a mess inside, melted terminals and insulation etc.
Scary thing is that the fuse did not blow

 

[skenk]

skenk, you really in france?...

Yes, since January, but back to sunny Glasgow this weekend.